T2 IRC Log: 2006-01-03

This is the log as captured by an IRC bot in the channel. The statements are those of the individual people and might not neccessarily reflect the policy and legal rules as set forth by the T2 SDE Project.

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--- Log opened Tue Jan 03 00:00:36 2006
00:07 < CIA-1> aldas * r14427 /trunk/package/games/liquidwar/liquidwar.desc: * updated liquidwar (5.6.2 -> 5.6.3)
00:20 < CIA-1> aldas * r14428 /trunk/package/multimedia/lives/lives.desc: * updated lives (0.9.1 -> 0.9.5)
00:40 -!- axion [n=axion@cpe-24-195-94-82.nycap.res.rr.com] has joined #t2
00:53 -!- nzg [n=tschmidt@p54AFF038.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit ["Leaving"]
00:58 < mnemoc> rehi
00:58 < morfoh> wb mnemoc
00:58 < mnemoc> morfoh: but if i do it for 2.2 rene will kill me
00:58 < mnemoc> thx morfoh :)
00:58 < morfoh> :)
01:00 < morfoh> already started a modified syne build ... wanna test latest grsec on 2.6.14.3 ... I know you don't like grsec anymore :p
01:01 < morfoh> and the chances should be quite good for getting a wrt target for 2.1 soon
01:37 -!- sparc-kly [n=mubex@64.237.244.104] has joined #t2
01:40 < madtux> mnemoc, doesn't like grsec no more?!
02:05 < mnemoc> i dislike grsec now
02:05 < mnemoc> go rsbac go
02:06 < madtux> hehe
02:06 < madtux> mnemoc, y eso?
02:07 < mnemoc> grsec development sucks, and rsbac provides the same and more, but open and with a real community around
02:08 < mnemoc> spender does what he wants, when he wants and how he wants, without giving anychange to know what and why is he doing something
02:09 < mnemoc> he has an cvs, which he re-inits randomly
02:09 < mnemoc> twice a week some times
02:09 < madtux> :)
02:24 < morfoh> rsbac is fine too ... ;)
02:40 -!- madtux [i=miguel@pf0.hostarica.com] has quit ["Leaving"]
02:41 < mnemoc> gn8
02:41 < morfoh> gn8 mnemoc
02:41 < mnemoc> go to sleep!
04:22 -!- menomc [n=amery@200.75.27.99] has joined #t2
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04:24 -!- menomc is now known as mnemoc
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06:34 < mipe> hi all
06:43 < mipe> hmm, actually 2.1.1 gcc also has some wierd values at libstdc++.la, -L/TOOLCHAIN for example, those shouldnt be in final libstdc++.la in chrooted build... i guess
07:34 -!- rxr_ [n=rene@e178168011.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #t2
07:34 -!- Topic for #t2: T2 | 2.1.1 TAGGED and 2.2.0-epsilon RELEASED! | The System Development Environment (SDE) | http://www.t2-project.org/ | Give us a greeting and don't hesitate to ask any questions you have :-)
07:34 -!- Topic set by mnemoc [] [Mon Jan 2 15:21:42 2006]
07:34 [Users #t2]
07:34 [@ChanServ] [ demian] [ mipe ] [ owl ] [ valentin]
07:34 [ axion ] [ jsaw ] [ mnemoc] [ rxr ] [ zod ]
07:34 [ Baldzius] [ karasz] [ morfoh] [ rxr_ ] [ _Ragnar_]
07:34 [ CIA-1 ] [ LMJ ] [ mtr_ ] [ sparc-kly_]
07:34 -!- Irssi: #t2: Total of 19 nicks [1 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 18 normal]
07:34 -!- Channel #t2 created Sun Aug 8 19:15:33 2004
07:34 -!- [freenode-info] if you're at a conference and other people are having trouble connecting, please mention it to staff: http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#gettinghelp
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08:17 -!- Topic for #t2: T2 | 2.1.1 TAGGED and 2.2.0-epsilon RELEASED! | The System Development Environment (SDE) | http://www.t2-project.org/ | Give us a greeting and don't hesitate to ask any questions you have :-)
08:17 -!- Topic set by mnemoc [] [Mon Jan 2 15:21:42 2006]
08:17 [Users #t2]
08:17 [@ChanServ] [ CIA-1 ] [ karasz] [ morfoh] [ rxr ] [ valentin]
08:17 [ axion ] [ demian] [ LMJ ] [ mtr_ ] [ rxr_ ] [ zod ]
08:17 [ Baldzius] [ jsaw ] [ mnemoc] [ owl ] [ sparc-kly_] [ _Ragnar_]
08:17 -!- Irssi: #t2: Total of 18 nicks [1 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 17 normal]
08:17 -!- Channel #t2 created Sun Aug 8 19:15:33 2004
08:17 -!- [freenode-info] if you need to send private messages, please register: http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#privmsg
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08:30 -!- mipe [n=mipe@dsl10040.japo.fi] has joined #t2
08:30 < mipe> and back, how i just love power cuts
09:12 < rxr> re
09:43 < CIA-1> rene * r14429 /trunk/package/network/clockspeed/ (clockspeed.conf x-cross.patch):
09:43 < CIA-1> * really fixed clockspeed to build on non-x86 and install only the
09:43 < CIA-1> available files - for some reason the ppc compiler was also unhappy
09:43 < CIA-1> about the auto_home define
09:45 -!- mipe [n=mipe@dsl10040.japo.fi] has quit ["leaving"]
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09:55 < mipe> hmm, my box yield 87W when idle and 117W when under target build
09:55 < rxr> heh
09:55 < rxr> do not want to know what my dual core eats ...
09:56 < rxr> at least my server eats 1W now ...
09:56 < mipe> i want that :)
09:56 < mipe> default freq scaling governor is setted during linux config?
09:56 < rxr> yes
09:56 < rxr> but you can change it on the fly
09:57 < mipe> its performance now, wouldnt ondemand be better?
09:57 < mipe> yep, changed to ondemand from performance
09:57 < rxr> historically the ondemand sucked
09:57 < rxr> no idea if it is usable today
09:57 < mipe> or, perhaps adding stone option that could set it to wanted value during bootup?
09:58 < rxr> well if ondemand works using that as default would be fine
09:58 < rxr> I think we should not clutter stone with too many detailed uptions
09:59 < rxr> also note that there are scaling daemons around
09:59 < mipe> ah yes...
09:59 < rxr> cpufreqd and such - they are there for a reason - because it is not done sanely in kernel-space
09:59 < rxr> it could be as simple as activating one
09:59 < mipe> yep, started cpufreqd
09:59 < rxr> I would rather see support for a local.rc thing as other dists have where a user can fill some lines to tweak /proc /sys as-needed
10:00 < mipe> yep
10:03 < mipe> btw. i looked up the cool-shop.de or so... there are lx and gx, where you running gx version of it? theres 100euro diff against those two versions...
10:04 < rxr> nope lx
10:04 < rxr> we are ordering in quantities, thus the price diff to the regular end-user price
10:29 -!- mipe [n=mipe@dsl10040.japo.fi] has quit ["reconn"]
10:31 < rxr> mnemoc: dietlibc select for ppc most proably fixed
10:31 < rxr> dietlibc in-system emerge with fix running / me showering ...
10:31 < rxr> cu soon
10:32 -!- mipe [n=mipe@dsl10040.japo.fi] has joined #t2
10:33 < rxr> yep
10:33 < mipe> oh 57W from my laptop
10:33 < rxr> do you messuare all your boxes now ?
10:34 < mipe> yep, i loaned the device from dad work... need to return it soon...
10:34 < mipe> has someone ever got linux24 to build on x64?
10:34 < rxr> i think yes
10:35 < owl> moin
10:35 < rxr> moin owl
10:35 < owl> hi rxr
10:35 < rxr> mnemoc: yeah, cockspeed on ppc64:
10:35 < rxr> # sntpclock 17.254.0.31 | clockview
10:35 < rxr> before: 2006-01-03 11:34:41.466054000000000000
10:35 < rxr> after: 2006-01-03 11:35:05.596106999955229460
10:35 < rxr> works now, select fixed indeed ,-)
10:36 < mipe> Automatically creating default configuration .... using: architecture/x86-64/kernel.conf.sh merging (system default(s)): arch/x86_64/defconfig arch/x86_64/configs/ppc64_d
10:36 < mipe> efconfig
10:36 < mipe> grep: arch/x86_64/configs/ppc64_defconfig: No such file or directory
10:36 < mipe> why in earth there is ppc64
10:36 < rxr> mipe: because this is wat latest 26 works ...
10:36 < rxr> changed that some weeks ago
10:37 < rxr> this is fine since it first tries some generic default
10:37 < mipe> ah ok
10:37 < rxr> mipe: my take: we should not try to merge this ever changing defconfig stuff in at all
10:37 < rxr> my proposal: remove this defconfig merge and make sure we have even better defaults in architecture/share et.al. to avoid those random noise source linux-kernel throws on us ..
10:38 < CIA-1> rene * r14430 /trunk/package/base/dietlibc/ppc-select.patch: * fixed dietlibc select for ppc/ppc64 (ony 64 was tested)
10:38 < mipe> hmm, btw. those grep dirs are wrong... there no /configs dir
10:39 < rxr> there is for at least ppc on linux26
10:40 < rxr> mipe: you wanted a todo: remove the defconfig merges and make sure the kernel builds and al runs fine with just out architecture/{$arch,share}/kernel defines
10:40 < mipe> ah yes, what i see only ppc,ia64,ppc64 has those dirs.. thats from linux24
10:41 < rxr> mipe: even nicer, since 2.6.15-rcX there is only powerpc for both 32 and 64 bit ...
10:41 < rxr> mips the same - more to follow most probably ...
10:41 < rxr> mipe: we should get rid of random merges from unknown defconfigs ...
10:41 < rxr> we can do much better improving our own defconfigs in architecture/*
10:44 < CIA-1> rene * r14431 /trunk/package/base/dietlibc/install-diet.patch:
10:44 < CIA-1> * fixed dietlibc to always install the diet wrapper, the vanilla one
10:44 < CIA-1> skips it on cross-builds
10:46 < Baldzius> good morning :)
10:46 < Baldzius> heh 2.6.15 is out
11:17 < jsaw> re
11:27 < jsaw> Hey, it's fifteen years today since I bought the machine that got Linux
11:27 < jsaw> started. January 2nd is a good date.
11:27 < jsaw> 2.6.15 Changelog --^
11:29 < jsaw> oh
11:29 < jsaw> sysctl: don't overflow the user-supplied buffer with '\0'
11:47 -!- rxr_ [n=rene@e178152219.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #t2
11:47 -!- Topic for #t2: T2 | 2.1.1 TAGGED and 2.2.0-epsilon RELEASED! | The System Development Environment (SDE) | http://www.t2-project.org/ | Give us a greeting and don't hesitate to ask any questions you have :-)
11:47 -!- Topic set by mnemoc [] [Mon Jan 2 15:21:42 2006]
11:47 [Users #t2]
11:47 [@ChanServ] [ demian] [ mipe ] [ owl ] [ valentin]
11:47 [ axion ] [ jsaw ] [ mnemoc] [ rxr ] [ zod ]
11:47 [ Baldzius] [ karasz] [ morfoh] [ rxr_ ] [ _Ragnar_]
11:47 [ CIA-1 ] [ LMJ ] [ mtr_ ] [ sparc-kly_]
11:47 -!- Irssi: #t2: Total of 19 nicks [1 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 18 normal]
11:47 -!- Channel #t2 created Sun Aug 8 19:15:33 2004
11:47 -!- [freenode-info] if you need to send private messages, please register: http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#privmsg
11:47 < rxr_> re
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11:49 < jsaw> rxr_: setting LIBTOOL=/usr/bin/libtool didn't work out, but I observed, that at least the "libdir" was correct in libstdc++.la
11:49 < jsaw> I'll try now setting LIBTOOL only for gcc
11:54 < jsaw> rxr_: do you have objections against a "sanitize_la" function in ./scripts/functions.in ?
11:55 -!- mtr [n=Michael@p54AFC4C6.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #t2
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12:05 < rxr_> jsaw: the function would do what ?
12:06 < jsaw> rxr_: cleanup dependency_libs, and also the /lib -> /usr/lib sed
12:07 < rxr_> I would not clean depdency_libs by default though - however some variable to trigger this, default off, would be ok
12:08 < jsaw> cleanup, in the sense of "make it human readable" ala sort -u
12:08 < jsaw> so, no tweaking
12:08 < rxr_> hm
12:08 < jsaw> tweaking/correcting .la would be sth. extra
12:09 < rxr_> let me look on a freebsd box if it is that way as well
12:09 < jsaw> O.O
12:10 < rxr_> locate "\.la"
12:10 < rxr_> t2@nexus$
12:10 < rxr_> hm
12:10 < rxr_> no la files at all ?
12:10 < jsaw> hehe
12:10 < jsaw> i think debian also removes them...iirc
12:11 -!- mtr_ [n=Michael@p54AF9EA0.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]
12:11 < rxr_> some libtool utilzing stuff will not build when they are not there, no ?
12:11 -!- You're now known as rxr
12:11 < rxr> jsaw: well, go, sort them ,-)
12:13 < jsaw> ok
12:16 < rxr> hm
12:16 < rxr> I just took a look on openembedded build
12:17 < jsaw> and?
12:17 < rxr> it is just a pain to actually get it (monotone with hours if not days to download database they write)
12:17 < rxr> and a hack to configure and build - that is vi config files and such
12:17 < rxr> I really wonder why so many people use it at all ...
12:18 < rxr> reading the getting started page again already makes me shiffer ...
12:23 < rxr> hm
12:23 < jsaw> hm, I start wondering if the .la sed is the problem
12:24 < jsaw> "s,\([ =']\)/lib\(.*\),\1/usr/lib\2,g"
12:24 < jsaw> ^
12:24 < jsaw> ups
12:24 < jsaw> I mean the \(.*\)
12:24 < jsaw> I think that should be \([^ ]*\)
12:25 < rxr> maybe also in the beginning ...
12:26 < jsaw> trying without first...
12:26 < karasz> moin all
12:28 < rxr> moin karasz
12:28 < jsaw> hi karasz
12:28 < karasz> after a good sleep things tend to look better
12:28 < jsaw> :)
12:29 < karasz> sorry for yesterdaqys wining, i guess it was the lack of sleep
13:19 -!- rene [n=rene@e178164226.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #t2
13:19 -!- Topic for #t2: T2 | 2.1.1 TAGGED and 2.2.0-epsilon RELEASED! | The System Development Environment (SDE) | http://www.t2-project.org/ | Give us a greeting and don't hesitate to ask any questions you have :-)
13:19 -!- Topic set by mnemoc [] [Mon Jan 2 15:21:42 2006]
13:19 [Users #t2]
13:19 [@ChanServ] [ CIA-1 ] [ karasz] [ mnemoc] [ valentin]
13:19 [ axion ] [ demian] [ LMJ ] [ mtr ] [ zod ]
13:19 [ Baldzius] [ jsaw ] [ mipe ] [ rene ] [ _Ragnar_]
13:19 -!- Irssi: #t2: Total of 15 nicks [1 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 14 normal]
13:19 -!- Channel #t2 created Sun Aug 8 19:15:33 2004
13:20 -!- Irssi: Join to #t2 was synced in 1 secs
13:20 -!- [freenode-info] if you need to send private messages, please register: http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#privmsg
13:20 < mnemoc> moin
13:20 < karasz> moin mnemoc
13:20 < rene> moin
13:20 < rene> hi mnemoc
13:20 -!- You're now known as rxr
13:20 < CIA-1> jsaw * r14433 /trunk/package/base/linux26/ (9 files):
13:20 < CIA-1> * update linux26 (2.6.15-rc7 -> 2.6.15)
13:20 < CIA-1> * update copyrights on the way
13:20 < mnemoc> moin karasz, cockspeed^Wrene
13:21 < jsaw> lol
13:21 < jsaw> hi mnemoc
13:21 < mnemoc> hi jsaw ,-)
13:21 < rxr> mnemoc: any tiny dns server to propose ?
13:21 < rxr> djbdns ?
13:21 < mnemoc> djbdns, of course
13:21 < rxr> anything else I have fight less than compile / link / load fluffery ?
13:21 < mnemoc> light, no
13:22 < rxr> mnemoc: I hope you have less headache today ?
13:22 < mnemoc> will be easier, due to your new expertise :)
13:23 < mnemoc> yes, no headache today
13:23 < axion> mornin
13:24 * karasz is wondering what to do today....
13:24 < mnemoc> wb axion, your box was down lastnight
13:24 < axion> mnemoc: hmm it was working for me and it says up 101 days
13:25 < mipe> hmm, what is ExactBuild
13:25 < mipe> ?
13:25 < mnemoc> 1) write 2.1.1 announcement 2) get opengroupware working over pure T2 3) fix 2 of my clipper widgets
13:25 < rxr> mipe: a auto* replacement to save my from headaches
13:25 < karasz> guys any chanse that trunk-desktop will work soon?
13:25 < mnemoc> axion: ssh: connect to host axion.yi.org port 22: Connection timed out
13:25 < karasz> or better i should 2.1?
13:25 < rxr> mipe: a non recursive makefile rule-set inspired by many how to use make the right way (tm) papers
13:25 < mnemoc> axion: but now it's working
13:26 < axion> mnemoc: good :) i see you got over 5G so far
13:26 < jsaw> rxr: did you read yesterday, the googling for "T2 SDE" the first hit is the https://www2 page?
13:26 < mnemoc> uhm
13:26 < rxr> uhm no missed that
13:27 < rxr> karasz: my plan is to resovlve the trunk breakage within this week
13:27 < mnemoc> http://www3.t2-project.org/ is better than www2, but slower :(
13:27 < rxr> and it is usually reasonable to archive this at that pace
13:27 < rxr> only this .la issue with gcc's libstdc++ bugs me majorly
13:27 < jsaw> it has to be corrected, www2 is not really usable (e.g. no menu for german language, as _are_ from #vserver complained)
13:28 < karasz> i guess that the la issue is the major showstopper...
13:28 < rxr> mnemoc: I asked yesterday (when my damn linksys reconnected one again thus might be gone to nirvana) whether to vserver or xen the upcomming gsmp server athlon ?
13:28 < karasz> isn't that right?
13:28 < rxr> karasz: yes
13:28 < karasz> then i will wait
13:28 < rxr> karasz: but my dual-core is building and rebuilding test builds and I want it fixed this week
13:28 < karasz> but my so-called freetime tends to expire :(
13:29 < mnemoc> rxr: vserver
13:30 < rxr> mnemoc: why? I prever xen ,-)
13:30 < rxr> karasz: I do not expect you to fix it ...
13:31 < karasz> i thought so
13:31 < mnemoc> rxr: vserver is not a virtual machine, is context isolation
13:31 < rxr> if you want a full build on the box to work I propose 2.1 or you do work now and build trunk next week ,-)
13:31 < mnemoc> rxr: so i has almost no performance effect
13:32 < rxr> mnemoc: xen is neither a virtual machine, just a hypervisor isolating OS domains as IBMs enterprise PPC boxes do
13:32 < rxr> mnemoc: xen has neither nearly no performance hit ... ,-)
13:32 < rxr> and we could run laternative OS instances ...
13:32 < rxr> mnemoc: have you seen xen performance charts ?
13:32 < karasz> hmm i guess i will svn a 2.1 for now
13:32 < mnemoc> the aditional kernel doesn't consume resources? ,-)
13:32 < karasz> just to not waste cpu cucles...
13:33 < rxr> mnemoc: sure it does, but we can run abbretary ones
13:33 < rxr> or even netbsd if we feel to
13:33 < mnemoc> if you want to run different kernels/OSs, sure. go for xen
13:34 < rxr> well I want a long term solution I prefer to touch the box as seldom as needed ...
13:34 < karasz> hmm what should i svn?
13:34 < rxr> especially because it is not near me ...
13:34 < karasz> tag/2.1.1?
13:34 < mnemoc> rxr: ok, xen :)
13:34 < mnemoc> karasz: yes, the tag is frozen
13:35 < rxr> damn
13:35 < mnemoc> ?
13:35 < rxr> djbdns has the same crappy installer hier.c ...
13:35 < karasz> ` svn co http://svn.exactcode.de/t2/tags/2.1.1/ 2.1.1` ?
13:35 < rxr> how can people even imagine to write such stuff ...
13:35 < mnemoc> :)
13:35 < rxr> that installer and compile technology does not create a warn feeling of trusting that kind of code in me
13:35 < karasz> is that right?
13:35 < rxr> karasz: yes
13:36 < mnemoc> rxr: :)
13:36 < rxr> or just the branchs/2.1 if you want to get one or another fix on the way ...
13:36 < karasz> also i want a full desktop, should i try desktop target?
13:36 < karasz> or generic +xorg+basic desktop?
13:36 < rxr> make clean
13:36 < rxr> make: *** No rule to make target `clean'. Stop.
13:36 < mnemoc> karasz: desktop should be fine.... i hope
13:36 < rxr> this software distribution really kinda sucks ...
13:36 < axion> rxr: when i ran the CreateISO script on my finished 2.2 build from svn, in menu,lst it gave the path i was working in with the t2 scripts for initrd....it was something like /home/axion/../initrd.img
13:36 < mnemoc> rxr: yes
13:37 < rxr> axion: some days ago ? I fixed this already 3-4 days ago ...
13:37 < axion> ok...yes it was about 3 days ago svn
13:37 < axion> didnt see a fix :-)
13:39 < rxr> the fix gone into misc/functions/initrd.sh or so
13:39 < mnemoc> axion: svn up at least twice per day
13:39 < rxr> well - that is if on trunk ,-)
13:40 < karasz> o_O
13:41 < karasz> mnemoc, http://karasz.pastebin.ca/35612
13:41 < karasz> is that normal?
13:41 < mnemoc> karasz: uhm, no... what is your host?
13:42 < karasz> t2 x86-64 minimal
13:42 < karasz> machine is a P4 with em64t
13:42 < mnemoc> i'll check on trunk if there is something to merge for rockdialog/64bits
13:42 < karasz> yup
13:43 < karasz> sounds like me....
13:43 < karasz> :D
13:43 < karasz> mnemoc, you should be afraid if i touch stable....
13:43 < karasz> with my karma you never know what could happen...
13:44 < mnemoc> nah ,-)
13:44 < karasz> it runs, but i exited to see the errors...
13:44 < rxr> warnings not errors
13:44 < mnemoc> karasz: but better use 2.1 branch, instead of the tag so you get any fix i have to do
13:45 < karasz> and that makes what to svn?
13:45 < mnemoc> r13153 | rene | 2005-11-04 16:59:26 -0300 (vie, 04 nov 2005) | 2 lines
13:45 < mnemoc> * silenced annoying signedness warning in rockdialog uncovered by gcc 4.0
13:45 < karasz> http://svn.exactcode.de/t2/branches/2.1/
13:45 < karasz> ?
13:45 < rxr> karasz: if you are at 2.1.1
13:45 < rxr> karasz: svn switch http://svn.exactcode.de/t2/branches/2.1
13:46 < mnemoc> svn switch is nice :)
13:47 < karasz> hey....
13:47 < karasz> who eat my EM64T optimizations...?
13:47 < rxr> karasz: that was freshly added to trunk
13:47 < rxr> choose athlon64 or generic x86_64 on 2.1 ...
13:47 < karasz> aint life beautifull...?
13:48 < karasz> oki
13:48 < rxr> jsaw: a fresh build without our static lib convertion let 1-gcc do the same junk
13:48 < karasz> AMD Athlon64?
13:48 < karasz> will it work?
13:48 < rxr> I have not tried but I assmue
13:48 < mnemoc> rxr: do you feel Config slower after i removed the ugly awk preprocessor?
13:48 < rxr> the minimal64 runs on the box ?
13:49 < karasz> i will go with generic i guess...
13:49 < rxr> then it shoudl work - the minimal64 is built for athlon64 ...
13:49 < karasz> minimal runs fine
13:49 < rxr> mnemoc: oh - have not noticed ...
13:49 < jsaw> rxr: yeah :(
13:49 < rxr> mnemoc: when did you remove it ?
13:49 < mnemoc> _the_ day
13:49 < rxr> as in today?
13:50 < Baldzius> heh, latest "subversion" compiles with latest "swig" & latest "neon"
13:50 < jsaw> rxr: I'll try to replace libtool in gcc now
13:50 < rxr> mnemoc: how many conf-{cc,ld} compile,link, ... packages do we have ?
13:50 < rxr> jsaw: gcc has no libtool - a ltconfig libtool is generated from
13:51 < rxr> Baldzius: ,-)
13:51 < jsaw> I meant libtool stuff
13:51 < rxr> Baldzius: officially ?
13:51 < rxr> Baldzius: dare to test latest apr and apache 2.2 as well ?
13:51 < Baldzius> rxr: dunno , works for me :)
13:52 < jsaw> rxr: but the dependency_libs cleanup looks nice already...
13:52 < Baldzius> rxr: ok, 'll try :)
13:52 < mnemoc> rxr: about 10
13:52 < rxr> mnemoc: worth adding a generic handler fo this kind of mega-junk?
13:52 < rxr> including printing a big far warning along the build output ?
13:52 * karasz needs to buy a PCI-X video card :(
13:52 < rxr> karasz: "need" ?
13:53 < karasz> yup
13:53 < rxr> why that ?
13:53 < karasz> i have only an on board 16 MB ati
13:53 < rxr> not enough?
13:53 < karasz> hardly good for desktop...
13:53 < rxr> would be good enough for me ..
13:53 < axion> same here
13:53 < karasz> mainly is because of resolution only 1024x768
13:53 < rxr> for most latest PCI-E you need latest greated x.org and kernel to get it working minimally ..
13:54 < rxr> karasz: nope 16MB allows much more ...
13:54 < rxr> 1600*1200*4
13:54 < rxr> 7680000
13:54 < karasz> that's what the card's book tells me...
13:54 < karasz> 1024x768x16
13:54 < rxr> that are "just" 7.x MB ...
13:54 < rxr> at ARGB, 32bit ...
13:55 < rxr> karasz: the book assumes minimal 3d or so ..
13:55 < karasz> ahm
13:55 < rxr> whatever - the card should be able to do more with the x.org dirver ...
13:55 < karasz> maybe
13:55 < karasz> we'll se...
13:55 < karasz> even see
13:55 < rxr> I would avoid to throw money at nvidia and ati for recent cards for the way they treat the open source community ...
13:55 < karasz> i am really not keen on buyin a new card
13:56 < karasz> as my budget is overspent allready
13:56 < rxr> if you only have normal 2d desktop usage the chip should be fine
13:56 < karasz> with the machine...
13:56 < karasz> i hope so
13:56 < karasz> i am not doin' video editin or 3d graphics...
13:57 < mnemoc> rxr: big fat warning about what? look for packages depending on bglibs
13:57 < karasz> today will be a quiet day
13:58 < mnemoc> for you
13:58 < karasz> mostly spent on dld
13:58 < karasz> mnemoc, i am allways talkin' about me
13:58 < mnemoc> :)
13:58 * karasz thinks `am i so egocentric?`....
13:59 < mnemoc> yes, you are
13:59 < rxr> warning that is has a ugly build system from hell and might eat a near pet, child, wife, ...
13:59 < mnemoc> hehe
13:59 < karasz> but for you it will also be a quiet day
13:59 < karasz> as i will have no questions and probs for a while :)
13:59 < mnemoc> karasz: :)
13:59 < mnemoc> you are not the only noise around :p
13:59 < rxr> what was the other thing? bcron?
14:00 < mnemoc> one of them
14:01 < rxr> .oO I fear the worst ...
14:01 < rxr> btw. bcron has no cache
14:01 < mnemoc> package/base/bcron/bcron.conf:20: pkgprefix libdir bglibs > conf-bglibs
14:01 < mnemoc> package/base/bcron/bcron.conf:21: pkgprefix includedir bglibs > conf-bgincs
14:01 < rxr> jadda jadda ...
14:02 < mnemoc> var_append yuck -I yuck yuck is uglier :)
14:02 < rxr> yeah all fine
14:02 * rxr has just enough from this style of packages ...
14:02 < rxr> whare have good old Makefils (tm) gone ...
14:03 -!- nzg [n=tschmidt@p54AFEA40.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #t2
14:03 < mnemoc> conf-* is an autoconf replacement
14:03 < mnemoc> not makefile replacement
14:03 < rxr> conf-* is not much better ...
14:03 < rxr> I mean normally you have makefile variables that ware nicer to use ...
14:03 < rxr> ware
14:03 < rxr> are ..
14:04 * rxr has to promote exact-build to the world ...
14:04 < LMJ> good morning rxr mnemoc & the chan
14:05 < karasz> bien venue SerWou :)
14:05 < LMJ> salut karasz
14:05 < LMJ> bienvenue is the right one ;)
14:05 < rxr> moin LMJ ,-)
14:05 < mnemoc> moin serwou
14:05 < LMJ> what's up guys in the 3rd day of 2006 ?
14:06 < mnemoc> rxr: as drop-in replacements :(
14:06 < mnemoc> LMJ: the same than any other day in any other year
14:06 < rxr> drop in replacement what ?
14:06 < LMJ> mnemoc , do you have a calendar at home ?
14:06 * rxr wonders if I shoudl convert the ugly screen nightmare to exact-build ...
14:07 < mnemoc> rxr: you could only save the world from autocrap giving drop-in replacements of those tools
14:07 < rxr> the geode: Mem: 491120 111144 379976 0 34048 55392
14:07 < rxr> that is:\
14:07 < rxr> Mem: 491120 111144 379976 0 34048 55392
14:07 < rxr> -/+ buffers/cache: 21704 469416
14:07 < rxr> only 21MB while running screen and irssi and some more stuff ...
14:08 < rxr> all dietlibc ...
14:08 < rxr> most of the memory is consumed by irssi
14:09 < mnemoc> 11906 amery 15 0 17640 11m 3184 S 0.0 2.4 6:09.26 irssi
14:10 < rxr> most of the user-space memoroy that is
14:10 < rxr> 1321 rene 15 0 2028 1824 768 S 0.0 0.4 0:09.09 irssi
14:11 < rxr> guess when I continue to make stuff cross aware I have coon all together to build a very compact, image for linksys routers completey cross ...
14:11 [Users #t2]
14:11 [@ChanServ] [ CIA-1 ] [ karasz] [ mnemoc] [ rxr ] [ _Ragnar_]
14:11 [ axion ] [ demian] [ LMJ ] [ mtr ] [ valentin]
14:11 [ Baldzius] [ jsaw ] [ mipe ] [ nzg ] [ zod ]
14:11 -!- Irssi: #t2: Total of 16 nicks [1 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 15 normal]
14:11 < mnemoc> that's the goal
14:12 < rxr> which would avoid the need to run the geode near the linksys at all and save me from this extreme reconnects the crappy software does ...
14:12 < karasz> 43717.000 bytes/sec guess it will take a while...
14:12 < rxr> karasz: I hope you use the download from the trunk tree ?
14:12 < karasz> nope
14:12 < rxr> reuse it
14:13 < karasz> how?
14:13 < rxr> it should save some bytes ...
14:13 < rxr> either move or copy ...
14:13 < karasz> i shoul cp in the right palce?
14:13 < rxr> mnemoc might have more suggestions ...
14:13 < karasz> but wont that be version conflivts?
14:13 < rxr> karasz: what is needed will still be downloaded
14:13 < rxr> but versions that are the same would be avoidded to be redownloaded ..
14:14 < karasz> cp right now...
14:14 < karasz> i should have thought of that
14:15 < rxr> there is also a way to specify an alternative location to featch from while download
14:15 < karasz> better yet i should have made a ln
14:15 < rxr> but I tend to forget the exact usage
14:16 < rxr> a symlink will not work I think
14:16 < mnemoc> download as symlink, works
14:16 < rxr> oh - ok
14:16 < mnemoc> what doesn't work is download/{local,mirror} as symlinks
14:17 < mnemoc> but Download -alt-dir is your friend
14:17 < mnemoc> rxr: http://leaf-project.org/
14:17 < rxr> .oO
14:18 < rxr> findsystime is also a evil thing ...
14:18 < rxr> mnemoc: that is ?
14:18 < mnemoc> yet-another-project-to-make-target
14:18 < rxr> ouhm
14:19 < CIA-1> amery * r14434 /branches/2.1/misc/rockdialog/ (dialog.h inputbox.c): * merged 13153 from trunk: silenced annoying signedness warning in rockdialog
14:20 < rxr> btw. svn mv rockdialog -> custdialog ...
14:20 < rxr> sdedialog ...
14:21 < mnemoc> you or i?
14:21 < rxr> EDONTCARE ...
14:21 < rxr> I can later
14:21 < mnemoc> before doining it, tell me. if i have already started doing it
14:21 < mnemoc> doing*
14:22 < rxr> but I would prefer s.th. like custdialog or so - not sdeconfig
14:22 < rxr> sdedialog
14:22 < mnemoc> confdialog?
14:22 < rxr> yeah
14:32 < rxr> == 01/03/06 15:32:31 =[1]=> Finished building package djbdns.
14:34 < CIA-1> rene * r14435 /trunk/package/network/djbdns/ (7 files): * fixed djbdns for cross builds
14:34 < rxr> including copyright update
14:35 < rxr> ok - updated .plan: openwrtg alike and monowall target due cebit ..
14:35 < rxr> that does fully cross build of course ...
14:36 < Baldzius> won't there be mass copyright update?
14:36 < rxr> Baldzius: we discussed this some days ago
14:36 < rxr> legally it is not too much defined whether that shoudl be done
14:36 < Baldzius> sorry, didn't notice :(
14:36 < rxr> other projects also only update on change
14:36 < rxr> also ti would be much noise without much need ...
14:37 < rxr> but we most likely run the update over all files on release ...
14:37 < rxr> and on changes until then
14:37 < rxr> mnemoc: how many hours does it take to dive thru the djbdns setup manual ?
14:38 < Baldzius> g*, i need to remember that :)
14:39 < Baldzius> i suffer from short term memory loss :))))
14:41 < mnemoc> rxr: no idea, i have been using it for years
14:41 < rxr> ouhm
14:41 < rxr> what do you use these days ?
14:42 < mnemoc> uhm? for dns? djbdns, of course
14:42 < rxr> 14:41 < mnemoc> rxr: no idea, i have been using it for years
14:42 < mnemoc> ah
14:43 < mnemoc> i guess tutorials from google
14:43 < mnemoc> btw, i apply these patches:
14:43 < mnemoc> SDECFGSET_PKG_DJBDNS_SIGHUP=1
14:43 < mnemoc> SDECFGSET_PKG_DJBDNS_MULTIDATA=1
14:43 < mnemoc> SDECFGSET_PKG_DJBDNS_DUMPCACHE=1
14:43 < mnemoc> SDECFGSET_PKG_DJBDNS_FWDZONE=1
14:44 < mnemoc> MULTIDATA and FWDZONE are the more useful
14:44 < rxr> I only need tinydns locally not internet ..
14:44 < mnemoc> dnscache?
14:45 < rxr> and a caching dns, since my ISP dns is regulary faulty ...
14:45 < rxr> mnemoc: more than cache - I used to have local nameserver for convienence ...
14:46 < mnemoc> FWDZONE is used to give dnscache the hability to ask another resolver for some zones, in my case ISP.
14:47 < mnemoc> MULTIDATA let you use different files instead of a unified one for all 'zones'
14:48 < rxr> I think I postpone this and do more important stuff now first
14:48 < mnemoc> i can help you with djbdns later :)
14:48 < rxr> later sounds good ,-)
14:49 < rxr> need to cook some noddles or so first so I do not fall from the chair ..
14:49 < rxr> and I need to continue usb kernel debugging ...
14:49 < rxr> and and and ...
14:49 < rxr> and I need to do some important uni stuff till next monday ...
14:50 < rxr> but I think I'll fork screen for the fun of it ...
14:50 < CIA-1> amery * r14436 /trunk/ (17 files in 3 dirs): * renamed rockdialog to confdialog, and fixed copyright notes to tell about ROCK.
14:52 < rxr> ack, Config still works ,-)
14:53 < mnemoc> of course still works
14:53 < mnemoc> :)
14:53 < rxr> just confirmed ...
14:53 < mnemoc> i'm not rene rebe
14:53 * mnemoc hides
14:53 < rxr> other renames caused regressions here and there ...
14:54 < rxr> e.g. your sysfiles stplit ...
14:54 < mnemoc> :)
14:57 < CIA-1> rene * r14437 /trunk/package/network/djbdns/djbdns.desc: * marked djbdns DIETLIBC
14:59 < mnemoc> :D
15:00 < rxr> mnemoc: /me fixed strace with dietlibc on ppc* this morning as well ...
15:00 < mnemoc> dietlibc becoming useful :)
15:00 < rxr> yeah - and the $confdir overloaded with patches ...
15:00 < mnemoc> i hope it could survive a non-crossbuild build
15:00 < mnemoc> hehe
15:01 < rxr> mnemoc: djbdns or what survival do you think about ?
15:01 < mnemoc> dietlibc
15:01 < rxr> you mean full system build with dietlibc ?
15:01 < mnemoc> i have been unable to do a normal build using dietlibc
15:01 < mnemoc> minimal
15:01 < rxr> yeah
15:01 < rxr> well - on my geode even gcc works ...
15:01 < rxr> cross build ..
15:01 < rxr> but some other stuff has problems
15:01 < mnemoc> i hope it could survive a non-crossbuild build :)
15:01 < rxr> sort memory corrupts and sed claims to be out of memory ...
15:02 < rxr> most probably they corrupt itself ...
15:02 < rxr> that are the real issues I can remeber off right now
15:02 < mnemoc> but it doesn't on glibc or uclibc
15:02 < rxr> mnemoc: often pure luck on mad code ..
15:02 < mnemoc> hehe :)
15:02 < rxr> like even binutils and gcc work with dietlibc ..
15:02 < rxr> and they are complex ...
15:02 < rxr> I type from a dietlibc'ed irssi ...
15:03 < rxr> sort and sed are nto that hard ...
15:03 < rxr> my minised works with dietlibc just fine ..
15:03 < rxr> but looking into the code I do not feel like debugging gnused or coreutils/sort on dietlibc the next days ..
15:03 < mnemoc> does minised take sed place if sed is not scheduled?
15:03 < rxr> mnemoc: no - I don't think so
15:04 < rxr> and I noticed some stuff that needs tweaking to survive t2 or auto/configure runs ...
15:04 < rxr> in minised ...
15:04 < mnemoc> :(
15:05 < rxr> well - I tinnk it is reasonable to assume some time this year we will be able to build a minimal with dietlibc and minised and some other mini stuff ..
15:08 < rxr> == 01/03/06 16:07:54 =[1]=> Finished building package tftp-hpa.
15:08 < rxr> `- dietlibc cross ...
15:10 < CIA-1> rene * r14438 /trunk/scripts/functions.in:
15:10 < CIA-1> * added INSTALLROOT to the DESTDIR a-like variables passed to make
15:10 < CIA-1> on install (used by at least tftp-hpa)
15:11 * mnemoc smells regressions
15:11 < rxr> mnemoc: usually in Makefiles just one $(DESTDIR) is used before all install files
15:11 < rxr> mnemoc: I saw noonw stupid enough to type all in one row ...
15:11 < jsaw> stay calm mnemoc, I'll add some other regressions a bit later
15:12 < mnemoc> cool :)
15:12 < rxr> yeah - in some days we rendered t2 unbuildable all over the place ...
15:12 < rxr> mnemoc: I can rebuild my embedded to see if all builds ...
15:12 < jsaw> the libtool stuff is so "nicely" integrated into gcc, that you can't rip/replace it without major hassle
15:12 < rxr> mnemoc: btw. the DESTDIR stuff is of course only set for cross builds
15:13 < mnemoc> :)
15:13 < rxr> jsaw: libtoolize -f helped a bit yesterday ...
15:13 < jsaw> it breaks 0-gcc here
15:13 < CIA-1> rene * r14439 /trunk/package/network/udhcp/udhcp.conf: * fixed udhcp to install example config into the sandbox
15:13 < jsaw> even only replacing libstdc++ stuff breaks 0-gcc
15:14 < jsaw> checking dynamic linker characteristics... ../configure: line 14683: F77_not_available_in_stage_0: command not found
15:14 < rxr> 0-gcc does not build libstdc++ ...
15:14 < jsaw> I know
15:14 < jsaw> still it does
15:14 < rxr> hm
15:14 < rxr> libtool considered evil more and more each passing second ...
15:16 < jsaw> har har
15:18 < CIA-1> rene * r14440 /trunk/package/network/tftp-hpa/tftp-hpa.desc:
15:18 < CIA-1> * fixed tftp-hpa to append cq to the AR variable as it does normally
15:18 < CIA-1> include those option and we set AR during crosss-builds and marked
15:18 < CIA-1> it DIETLIBC
15:18 < rxr> mnemoc: so - /me now rebuilding embedded
15:18 < rxr> mnemoc: to make sure there are not too many new regressions ...
15:18 < jsaw> while :; do echo -n 'sh*t f*ck libtool '; done
15:20 < mnemoc> exactlt :)
15:20 < jsaw> rxr: where's the "CXX_not_available..." etal set
15:20 < jsaw> _
15:20 < jsaw> ?
15:20 < rxr> gcc parse-config or so
15:20 < rxr> mnemoc: the tested embeded includes a lot more than a vanilla one:
15:20 < rxr> target/embedded# svn diff | grep '^+/' | cut -d ' ' -f 2 | tr '\n' ' '
15:20 < mnemoc> grep not_available scripts/*
15:20 < rxr> sed ncurses grep make udev cpio mininet rng-tools libowfat gatling udhcp clockspeed djbdns tftp-hpa
15:21 < mnemoc> :D
15:21 < rxr> and it all built, with dietlibc ...
15:21 < mnemoc> but cross
15:21 < rxr> should I just commit that to have a know list for the example embedde d?
15:22 < mnemoc> i don't use embedded target, i try to have a normal target doing the same
15:22 < rxr> mnemoc: not "but" cross, _even_ cross ...
15:23 < rxr> mnemoc: embedded is so cool because we can build all this stuff for any architecture we want, from any architecture we have under the fingertips right now ...
15:23 < rxr> and it reduces compile time, this one-pass build only consumes one hour or so on the dual core ppc64
15:23 < mnemoc> yes, but restricted to _one_ target
15:24 < rxr> why one?
15:24 < mnemoc> embedded
15:24 < rxr> the technology and patchset is what matters ...
15:25 * mnemoc starting a normal but dietlibc build with 80 packages...
15:25 < jsaw> --enable-languages=c,c++
15:25 < jsaw> ^-- stage 0
15:25 < rxr> jsaw: of course
15:25 < rxr> but I patch libstdc++ away
15:25 < rxr> we need c++ without libstdc++ for for C++ cross-builds
15:25 < jsaw> then why CXX_not_available_in_stage0 ??
15:26 < rxr> in 1-gcc we build c,c++ with libstdc++
15:26 < rxr> isn't it the target cc?
15:26 < rxr> we do not have yet?
15:26 < jsaw> har har
15:26 < rxr> maybe the libtool stuff in gcc has some more host vs. target differentiation ...
15:27 < rxr> compared to the libtool styff you injected ?
15:27 < jsaw> I set CXX=/bin/false
15:27 < jsaw> then:
15:27 < jsaw> checking for exception model to use... configure: error: unable to detect exception model
15:27 < rxr> is that in libstdc++ ?
15:27 < jsaw> yes
15:28 < jsaw> it runs the configure of libstdc++ anyway
15:28 < rxr> it should not be built at all
15:28 < jsaw> while :; do echo -n 'sh*t f*ck autocrap '; done
15:28 < rxr> I think that is not correct
15:28 < CIA-1> rene * r14441 /trunk/target/embedded/config.in:
15:28 < CIA-1> * added a whole bunch of packages to the example, reference embedded
15:28 < CIA-1> that are known to cross build these days
15:28 < rxr> package/base/gcc# vi no-libstdc++.patch.cross0\
15:28 < rxr> maybe you regen does not include this patch ?
15:29 < jsaw> checking
15:30 < jsaw> getting coffee...
15:30 < rxr> had coffee enough today
15:31 < rxr> need some lunch soon ...
15:31 < CIA-1> rene * r14442 /trunk/package/base/gcc/no-libstdc++.patch.cross0: * commented the no-libstdc++.patch.cross0
15:32 < rxr> load average: 5.61, 4.96, 3.24 <- dual core building t2 bits like crazzy to finally get trunk fully useful again ...
15:33 < rxr> hm
15:33 < rxr> I think this mkpkg stuff should be in sysfiles ...
15:33 < mnemoc> and where it is?
15:34 < rxr> it is in sysfiles ...
15:34 < rxr> shoudl not be ...
15:34 < rxr> should not be ...
15:34 < mnemoc> :)
15:34 < mnemoc> another split?
15:34 < rxr> yes
15:35 < rxr> I split rc out of sysfiles right now ..
15:35 < mnemoc> i think rc should belong to sysvinit
15:35 < rxr> ack
15:35 < rxr> that is where I just relocate it ..
15:35 < mnemoc> :)
15:35 < rxr> test build going ...
15:38 < CIA-1> rene * r14443 /trunk/package/base/ (4 files in 2 dirs): * moved sbin/rc from sysfiles into sysvinit
15:38 < rxr> do we actually want mkpkg ?
15:39 < mnemoc> i guess we do
15:39 < rxr> hm
15:39 < jsaw> rxr: I skipped the autoconf stuff in stage 0, then it works, the question remains: how can it break if I only regen in the libstdc++ subdirectory....
15:39 < mnemoc> to control third party packages
15:40 < rxr> jsaw: you skipped what autoconf stuff ?
15:40 < jsaw> now it gets interesting again... started 1-gcc
15:40 < jsaw> rxr: I regen configure+libtool stuff for libstdc++ only
15:40 < jsaw> and hope...
15:41 < rxr> I thought libstdc++ has no ltconfig / libtool
15:41 < rxr> have I overlooked s.th.?
15:41 < jsaw> see acinclude.m4
15:41 < jsaw> sinclude(../libtool.m4)
15:42 < rxr> sure but when you regen in libstdc++ only you will not have an updated libtool, will you ?
15:42 < jsaw> see above
15:42 < jsaw> 16:40 < jsaw> and hope...
15:42 < rxr> I run right now a 1-gcc where I libtoolize -f ..
15:42 < rxr> though the patch would be huge ...
15:42 < jsaw> good luck
15:43 < rxr> when it works we could include this resulting ltconfig.patch into the gcc confdir and hope ..
15:43 < rxr> worked
15:43 < rxr> well - at least libstdc++ built
15:44 < jsaw> and how does .la look like?
15:44 < rxr> # Libraries that this one depends upon.
15:44 < rxr> dependency_libs=' -lm '
15:44 < jsaw> oh
15:44 < jsaw> :)
15:44 < jsaw> :D
15:44 < jsaw> commit commit commit
15:44 < rxr> need to diff and hope just diffing ltconfig is enough
15:45 < rxr> that is I do not want to include the whole libtoolize -f junk ...
15:45 < rxr> the 32bit flavour also looks the same:
15:45 < rxr> # Libraries that this one depends upon.
15:45 < rxr> dependency_libs=' -lm '
15:47 < rxr> ltmain.sh | 3891 +++++++++++++++++++++++++--------------
15:47 < rxr> config.guess | 552 ++---
15:47 < rxr> config.sub | 76
15:48 < rxr> - exit 0 ;;
15:48 < rxr> + exit ;;
15:48 < rxr> ?
15:48 -!- morfoh [n=jeru@p54BEE216.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #t2
15:48 < karasz> wb morfoh
15:48 < CIA-1> amery * r14444 /trunk/package/develop/clip/ (hotfix_clip_clic.y.patch hotfix_clip_file.c.patch): * fixed some issues on clip compiler
15:48 < morfoh> thx karasz :)
15:49 < rxr> .oO
15:49 < rxr> hey morfoh !
15:49 < morfoh> btw ... hi *
15:49 < morfoh> :)
15:51 < morfoh> rxr: afaik ... you did sme changes on embutils. did you checked it also agains uclibc ?
15:51 < rxr> embutils ?
15:51 < rxr> no I rarely use uclibc so far ...
15:51 < jsaw> rxr: shall I still commit the "dependeny_libs" sanitation ?
15:51 < jsaw> rxr: or should we rather check of -L*/TOOLCHAIN/* etal stuff
15:52 < rxr> jsaw: can you leave it locally until we have a state where trunk builds nicely again ?
15:52 < jsaw> rxr: so that we can correct libtool in these packages
15:52 < rxr> jsaw: rege libtool in those packages or post fixup ?
15:52 < jsaw> rxr: I'd prefer fixing libtool instead of tweaking .la to be honest
15:53 < rxr> jsaw: me too
15:53 < mnemoc> will you fix libtool?
15:53 < jsaw> ok, so I'll change and add a check
15:53 * karasz will be shortly away for a bit
15:53 < rxr> jsaw: like marking the packages LIBTOOL-QUIRK ?
15:54 < jsaw> not yet, only adding a warning, that "dependency_libs" contains paths from the build system for now
15:54 < rxr> jsaw: ack
15:54 < rxr> but how to fix?
15:54 < rxr> propose to mark the pkg LIBTOOK-QUIRK in the warning ?
15:54 < jsaw> most probably LIBTOOL-QUIRK
15:54 < jsaw> :)
15:54 < jsaw> yep
15:57 < rxr> btw. berln min. temperature was -8.9 degre C here on my out-side wall of the flat this winter
15:57 < morfoh> that's not that much
15:57 < rxr> morfoh: I'm quite encouraged to help a lot on t2'ed wrtg
15:58 < rxr> morfoh: I'm quit annoyed from the broken firmware, e.g. reconnrects pppoe a-lot know that I use it for routing ...
15:58 < morfoh> rxr: yeah ... I guess I've the most important things building
15:58 < rxr> morfoh: trunk embedded HEAD has a lot more packages that just build now ...
15:58 < morfoh> on mips and i386
15:59 < rxr> tweaked embedded or on a new target?
15:59 < rxr> cross everything I guess ?
15:59 < morfoh> rxr: yeah ... but Iguess we don't need some package on the wrt target if we speak about a router/firewall and not about a "bitch" ... sorry ;)
15:59 < morfoh> rxr: yep
16:01 < morfoh> rxr: I manipulated the embedded target so far
16:01 < morfoh> rxr: rxr did you ever tested the MIPS support in qemu ?
16:02 < morfoh> I know ... you don't have to
16:02 < jsaw> where's the gcc patch....rxr? Can't wait....
16:04 * mnemoc just noticed udhcpd has undocumented support for static_leases
16:05 < morfoh> the needed wireless stuff for a wrt target builds too
16:05 < morfoh> mnemoc: you didn't knew ? :p
16:06 < morfoh> mnemoc: like you complained about dropbear and scp :p
16:06 < mnemoc> morfoh: it's not on the man page :)
16:06 < morfoh> mnemoc: now ... you want to tell me that master is reading man pages ? :)
16:07 < mnemoc> well.... alias rsync='rsync --rsh='\''ssh -i /home/amery/.ssh/id_rsa'\'''
16:07 < mnemoc> alias scp='scp -i /home/amery/.ssh/id_rsa'
16:07 < mnemoc> alias ssh='ssh -i /home/amery/.ssh/id_rsa'
16:07 < karasz> i wonder why my failed build didn't say that kde is pending...
16:07 < mnemoc> ^--- that is _not_ confortable
16:08 < mnemoc> morfoh: yes, i do read manpages :)
16:08 < mnemoc> morfoh: not deeply, but i do
16:08 < CIA-1> amery * r14445 /branches/2.1/package/develop/clip/ (hotfix_clip_clic.y.patch hotfix_clip_file.c.patch): * merged 14444 from trunk: fixed some issues on clip compiler
16:10 < morfoh> mnemoc: hopefully you don't use man pages as a resource for good night stories for your girlies :p
16:11 < mnemoc> man bash :)
16:11 < morfoh> "have nice dreams kids" :p
16:12 < Baldzius> man shutdown :)
16:12 < CIA-1> rene * r14446 /trunk/package/base/gcc/libtool-junk-regen.patch: * regenerated gcc's ltmain.sh to fixup major libstdc++.la hickup
16:13 < rxr> jsaw: looks good
16:13 < rxr> jsaw: on a minimlal ppc64 ..
16:13 * rxr now starting a full ppc64 desktop build and goes consuming noddles ...
16:13 < rxr> cu
16:13 < morfoh> Baldzius: I'm happy that you don't said man shoot down
16:14 < Baldzius> sorry :(
16:14 < jsaw> rxr: nice
16:15 < morfoh> rxr: while eating your noodles you can prepare a small list what you'll need on your wrt ... I guess we don't need all the fluff which is available on openwrt right now
16:18 < morfoh> Baldzius: sorry ... I didn't wanted to make you cry ... gun boy ;)
16:18 < Baldzius> :)
16:20 < rxr> morfoh: only normal network routing, firewalling
16:20 < rxr> later a web interface to promote t2 to normal users
16:20 < rxr> and I personally need irssi ...
16:20 < rxr> but that does not need to be on the vanilla dist for it .,.
16:20 < mnemoc> irssi means glib
16:21 < mnemoc> morfoh: don't forget about sedu
16:21 < morfoh> mnemoc: my problem is that I don't forget anything :(
16:22 < morfoh> mnemoc: but sedu is def. on my todo ... so don't cry too ;)
16:22 * morfoh hides
16:23 * mnemoc need to patch udhcpd to export some env vars and be able to update dns on notify_script
16:23 < mnemoc> morfoh: i'm not crying, i simply don't see commits from you
16:23 < morfoh> mnemoc: "el-cheapo dyndns" ?
16:23 < mnemoc> tinydns
16:23 * morfoh hides again
16:23 < mnemoc> but yes
16:24 < Baldzius> rxr: latest "subversion" compiles with latest "apr" either latest "apache" :)
16:24 < mnemoc> but el-cheapo dyndns is http://innominate.org/projects/tinydyndns/
16:25 < morfoh> mnemoc: this was with the pop account ... right ? ;)
16:25 < mnemoc> yes, a fake pop server
16:25 < morfoh> mnemoc: runit's master seems to have funny ideas :)
16:26 < mnemoc> i prefer something linked to dhcp
16:26 < mnemoc> but of course pop is more 'flexible'
16:27 < Baldzius> hehehehe, my new subversion now segfaults, i guess it's related to apr
16:27 < Baldzius> it worked before
16:29 < rxr> .oO
16:30 < jsaw> oh, segfaults are recorded in /var/log/messages now
16:30 < rxr> jsaw: nope - only on x86-64 ...
16:31 < jsaw> ic
16:31 < rxr> though I never bothered to take a look why ...
16:31 < Baldzius> i've checked, there are nothing
16:31 -!- owl [n=owl@62.4.80.218] has joined #t2
16:31 -!- owl [n=owl@62.4.80.218] has quit [Client Quit]
16:31 < morfoh> i need a coffee .. brb
16:32 < Baldzius> i'll try to downdate apr
16:32 < jsaw> oh, pam 0.81 -> 0.99.2.1
16:32 -!- madtux [i=miguel@pf0.hostarica.com] has joined #t2
16:32 < madtux> hello.
16:33 < rxr> holla miguel
16:33 < mnemoc> wb madtux
16:33 < mnemoc> hola* :)
16:33 < madtux> thx miny.
16:33 < madtux> hey Rene :)
16:34 < rxr> mnemoc: oh
16:37 -!- owl [n=owl@62.4.80.218] has joined #t2
16:37 < rxr> hi owl
16:37 < jsaw> rxr: obviously it doesn't matter, but, while compiling 1-gcc,libstdc++: libtool: ignoring unknown tag CXX
16:37 < owl> hi
16:38 < rxr> jsaw: hm
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16:43 < CIA-1> rene * r14447 /trunk/package/network/gatling/gatling.conf:
16:43 < CIA-1> * fixed gatling not waste time building test and benchmark stuff and
16:43 < CIA-1> to only try to build tlsgatling if openssl is available
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16:44 < mnemoc> rxr: have you seen this before? http://www.rafb.net/paste/results/7prry071.html
16:45 < rxr> mnemoc: hm - what gui browser to use ...
16:45 < mnemoc> rxr: links -g
16:46 < rxr> links -g sucks and on ppc64 even draws with corrupted colors, either endian or 64 bit breakage ...
16:46 < rxr> but as I see a line of text anyway ..
16:46 < morfoh> hola owlita + madtux ... :)
16:46 * rxr needs to get konqueror on the ppc64 ...
16:46 < rxr> my oh my ...
16:46 < rxr> mnemoc: what is that from ?
16:46 < owl> hi morfoh
16:46 < morfoh> rxr: you're quite relegious the last days
16:47 < mnemoc> rxr: i always get that when building minimal mnemosyne against dietlibc
16:47 < rxr> morfoh: ?
16:47 < rxr> trunk ?
16:47 < morfoh> "my oh my" ...
16:47 < mnemoc> my oh my gosh*
16:47 < morfoh> and read the logs from yesterday
16:47 < mnemoc> rxr: 2.1
16:47 < rxr> mnemoc: ha!
16:47 < rxr> cought you ...
16:47 < rxr> with dynamic or static dietlibc ?
16:48 < mnemoc> default :)
16:48 < rxr> looks like such an mixup ...
16:48 < rxr> hm
16:48 < rxr> would need to debug either ...
16:48 < mnemoc> what and how?
16:48 < rxr> embedded dietlibc static only builds bzip2 ...
16:48 < mnemoc> but i don't want static :(
16:49 < rxr> mnemoc: I only said what is known to build - not what you must build ...
16:49 < rxr> mnemoc: when I have more time in some days I could ssh to you or so ..
16:49 < morfoh> mnemoc: rafb :)
16:49 < mnemoc> 42.vg died
16:50 < rxr> who died ?
16:50 < morfoh> not man pages :)
16:50 < mnemoc> rxr: a paste service :)
16:50 < mnemoc> rxr: so dietlibc is only workins for static builds?
16:50 < mipe> rxr: does the www.cool-*.de ship to finland, they should make english website too :(
16:51 < rxr> mnemoc: on some arches x86, arm (but did not work for me) it has dynamic ...
16:51 < rxr> but I do not test it
16:51 < rxr> because when I want it tiny I want it multi-arch ..
16:51 < rxr> I tried dynamic in the past and at that time it worked on x86 ...
16:51 < rxr> I can not guess whats wrong from here ...
16:51 * mnemoc will fight to not fallback to uclibc
16:52 < mipe> does the gcc libstdc++ patch work?
16:52 < CIA-1> rene * r14448 /trunk/target/embedded/config.in:
16:52 < CIA-1> * enavled sysfiles on embedded, know that it does not include some
16:52 < CIA-1> random stuff and rc anymore it is useful
16:52 < rxr> mipe: for me so far ys
16:52 < rxr> +e
16:52 < rxr> mnemoc: I thought you like uclibc ?
16:53 < morfoh> rxr: 2.6M <-- simple uclibc rootfs for a wrtg
16:53 < jsaw> mnemoc: that's an error in Makefile-bzshared
16:53 < jsaw> or how it is called
16:53 < rxr> embedded build finished ...
16:54 < rxr> no beside gating I fixed on-the-way no regressions ...
16:54 < jsaw> mnemoc: the "-shared" flag is missing
16:54 < rxr> and gating was a "accidently built yesterday" kind of thing only ...
16:54 < mnemoc> rxr: i like dietlibc, but uclibc works :)
16:54 < mnemoc> jsaw: let see...
16:54 < rxr> so - what else could I use on my geode ..
16:54 < rxr> ah bcron
16:55 < rxr> but I really wonder if I want to hack it and bglib or so to cross build ...
16:55 < mnemoc> bcron needs bglibs
16:55 < mnemoc> rxr: yes, you want
16:55 < rxr> why?
16:55 < mnemoc> they are core packages of mnemosyne :)
16:56 < jsaw> huh
16:56 < mnemoc> and you want mnemosyne cross compiling :)
16:56 < rxr> I want ?
16:56 < morfoh> mnemoc: hehe :)
16:56 < jsaw> mnemoc: $(CC) $(CFLAGS) -o bzip2-shared bzip2.c libbz2.so.1.0.3
16:56 < mnemoc> yes, you want
16:56 < morfoh> yeah .... cross compiling mnemosyne ... .that would be fun :)
16:56 < jsaw> mnemoc: bzip2.c ?
16:56 < rxr> mnemoc: why?
16:57 < rxr> morfoh: do you have a wrtg to test ?
16:57 < mnemoc> rxr: because it will make you happy
16:57 < rxr> garuanteed ?
16:57 < mnemoc> yeah
16:57 < rxr> uhm - why so ?
16:57 < morfoh> rxr: nope ... no wrt to test yet
16:57 < mnemoc> because morfoh and poor mnemoc will be very happy
16:57 < morfoh> but I can prepare an image for you
16:57 < rxr> hm - I have one here - but it is in production use
16:57 < rxr> that is my neighboor will screem when it is down again ..
16:58 < morfoh> mnemoc: you missed the poor before morfoh :p
16:58 < jsaw> moving home, cu
16:58 < rxr> cu jsaw
16:58 < morfoh> cu jsaw
16:58 < mnemoc> nah, morfoh is not poor :) just unemployed :p
16:58 < mnemoc> cu jsaw
16:58 < morfoh> mnemoc: you're so right my friend
16:59 < morfoh> rxr: thought your neighbor was in india or so ?
16:59 < morfoh> or is
16:59 < morfoh> anyway I wanted to test mips on qemu
16:59 < rxr> morfoh: she's back since a few days ...
16:59 < morfoh> but I ran into problems building i yesterday
17:00 < rxr> just shortly before I powered down the rs6k and she came screaming because I had not yet dhcp on the geode ...
17:00 < mnemoc> hehe
17:00 < rxr> had not noticed she is back yet ...
17:00 < rxr> == 17:58:50 =[1]=> Building develop/bglibs [1.031 2.2.0-alpha].
17:00 < rxr> == 01/03/06 18:00:22 =[1]=> Finished building package bglibs.
17:00 < morfoh> rxr: anyway ... I've to order a wrt for real testing
17:01 < rxr> `- it did just cross build ?
17:01 * rxr can hardly believe ...
17:01 < rxr> haha
17:01 < rxr> installed into the sandbox using the system cc ...
17:02 < morfoh> rxr: btw, I propose the target name "wrt2" or so .. ;)
17:02 < rxr> acked
17:02 < rxr> though what do we do when they release a 2 for real, ...
17:02 < morfoh> rxr: that's not our problem :p
17:02 < morfoh> I hope :)
17:03 < morfoh> anyway the free project is called openwrt ... so they can name it openwrt2 ;)
17:03 < rxr> openwrt++
17:03 < mnemoc> :)
17:04 < mnemoc> exactwrt
17:04 < morfoh> mnemoc: hell :)
17:04 < rxr> morfoh: do you plan to order one yourself or should we use mine some day for testing ?
17:05 < morfoh> rxr: I have to order one
17:05 < morfoh> rxr: as I told you I would like to test the image on qemu first ...
17:05 < rxr> /* bg-installer.c - Standard bglibs installer system.
17:06 < rxr> `- what kind of drugs do those people consume ...
17:20 < rxr> hehe grandma just phoned ...
17:20 < rxr> did not wanted to wake me up early on the first .. ,-)
17:21 < mnemoc> how cute :)
17:23 < rxr> hm - at least blibs seems to build with dietlibc ...
17:23 < rxr> well - why must it have this doomed build system ..
17:24 < mnemoc> no idea
17:25 < rxr> am I the only one thinking it stinks?
17:27 < mnemoc> no, there are lot of detractors... and no answer about why it's used
17:27 < rxr> lots of as in terms of complains on the mailing list ?
17:27 < mnemoc> yes
17:27 < mnemoc> every month someone screams
17:30 < rxr> have you looked what this detach you posted here does ?
17:30 < rxr> you posted a sf.net link when I asked for a screen rewrite ...
17:31 < mnemoc> detach
17:32 < mnemoc> yes, i have read about it
17:32 < mnemoc> but never used it
17:32 < rxr> and read it can do what ?
17:33 < mnemoc> it's a simplified implementation of 'screen'
17:33 < mnemoc> http://dtach.sourceforge.net/
17:34 < mnemoc> my first url was wrong
17:34 < Baldzius> as i thought, apr was segfaulting subversion and again i don't like .conf :)
17:34 < mnemoc> this is the right one
17:35 < mnemoc> rxr: http://dtach.sourceforge.net
17:35 < Baldzius> apr 1.2.2 + apache 2.2.0 + subversion 1.3.0 works ok
17:35 < Baldzius> still :)
17:35 < rxr> no segfaults anymore ?
17:36 < Baldzius> no
17:36 < Baldzius> removed apr.conf :)
17:39 < Baldzius> g* , yes no segfaults anymore :)
17:41 < morfoh> mnemoc: btw, what is the current status of sedu ? perhaps it would be nice to make sedu a "cross-compiling-only" target
17:42 < mnemoc> morfoh: we can't move any needed package to stage1
17:42 < morfoh> mnemoc: which one ?
17:44 < morfoh> Baldzius: do you have qemu on your machine ?
17:45 < Baldzius> morfoh: no, why u ask?
17:45 < mnemoc> morfoh: basicly the thing is you must be able to build a dietlibc-based target with any package capable of building against dietlibc
17:45 < mnemoc> morfoh: sedu is just one of those targets
17:46 < morfoh> Baldzius: I just thought because it seems you're building lots of packages ;) and because it failed here on my machine
17:46 < Baldzius> :))))
17:46 < Baldzius> duno why it fails
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17:51 -!- mnemoc [n=amery@200.75.27.99] has joined #t2
17:52 < morfoh> wb mnemoc :)
17:52 < mnemoc> :(
17:53 < morfoh> ?
17:53 < mnemoc> daily disconnections are not a happy thing
17:53 < mnemoc> jsaw: http://www.rafb.net/paste/results/Gyu51o97.html <--- commit? ,-)
17:54 < mnemoc> rxr: is dtach what you need?
17:54 < morfoh> mnemoc: yeah ... I guess we've to struggle with our beloved dietlibc some more time to get a working sedu out of it
17:55 < mnemoc> basicly i want first a minimal-mnemosyne, native, and 'lightweight'
17:56 < morfoh> afais basic router/fw things should work and quagga is building on diet here but without vtysh support ... that's not that nice
17:56 < mnemoc> quagga server is not a lightweight to me
17:57 < mnemoc> so no need to put it on diet
17:57 < morfoh> hmm ... perhaps you're
17:57 < morfoh> and we've no mips support with diet
17:58 < mnemoc> Building tools in build/.../TOOLCHAIN/tools.chroot:
17:58 < mnemoc> -> Building tools.chroot/wrapper/cmd_wrapper.
17:58 < mnemoc> gcc: : No such file or directory
17:58 < mnemoc> -> Unmounting loop mounts ...
17:58 < mnemoc> ^--- entering stage 2 on a diet-based build
17:58 < morfoh> oops
17:59 < mnemoc> but # chroot build/sedu-2.1-stable-x86-pentium2-sedu/ gcc --version
17:59 < mnemoc> gcc (GCC) 3.4.4
17:59 < morfoh> :)
17:59 < mnemoc> well... that is current state
18:00 < morfoh> that sounds promissing ;)
18:01 < mnemoc> not bad
18:01 < mnemoc> uclibc segfaults entering stage2 were worse :)
18:01 < morfoh> :)
18:01 < mnemoc> i was 4 months on that until jsaw decided to take a look and found a bug on fl_wrapper :(
18:02 < mnemoc> he deserves his doctor-ship :)
18:02 < morfoh> I'm sorry for ya
18:02 < morfoh> :)
18:02 < mnemoc> or however it's called there
18:10 < morfoh> Creating binary package file for linux-header.
18:10 < morfoh> -> Building build/.../pkgs/linux-header
18:10 < morfoh> ./scripts/Build-Target: line 182: 930 Broken pipe grep -v ' var/adm' var/adm/flists/$pkg_name
18:10 < morfoh> trunk
18:10 < mnemoc> HEAD?
18:10 < morfoh> yepp
18:11 < morfoh> the upcoming wrt2 target cross-compiling for mipsel
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18:12 < mnemoc> strace :)
18:12 < mnemoc> probably your grep is misscompiled
18:13 < morfoh> probably ... I'll check ;)
18:16 < demian> hi
18:16 < mnemoc> hi demian
18:16 < morfoh> hi demian
18:16 < demian> happy new year.
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18:18 -!- nzg [n=tschmidt@p54AFEA40.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection]
18:21 < mnemoc> happy new year demian
18:22 < demian> thanks, u 2.
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18:25 < morfoh> mnemoc: unf. a uclibc based target is a bit smaller than a simillar static dietlibc build
18:26 < mnemoc> *G*
18:26 < mnemoc> where is rxr ?
18:26 < morfoh> mnemoc: I'd like to have it the other way :p
18:39 < rxr> == 19:34:16 =[2]=> Building base/gcc [4.0.2 2.2.0-alpha].
18:41 < mnemoc> rxr: wait!
18:41 < mnemoc> rxr: http://www.rafb.net/paste/results/wGAF0Y73.html <--- watch this
18:46 < mnemoc> :'(
18:47 -!- nzg [n=tschmidt@p54AFDBE1.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #t2
18:50 < mnemoc> jsaw: are you around?
18:52 < Baldzius> scripts/functions.in: line 97: bjam: command not found
18:53 < Baldzius> ^^ -- what's that?
18:53 < mnemoc> tree?
18:54 < mnemoc> what stage-package?
18:54 < Baldzius> a?
18:54 < Baldzius> trunk
18:54 < Baldzius> got this on Emerge-Pkg
18:54 < Baldzius> 9-boost
18:56 < mnemoc> you need boost-jam
18:57 < Baldzius> :)
18:57 < Baldzius> g*- i am stupid :)
18:57 < Baldzius> thanx :)
18:57 < Baldzius> forgot -deps=indirect
18:58 < rxr> mnemoc: ?
18:59 < mnemoc> rxr: i need some ilumination in regard to BUILDCC and Build-Tools
18:59 < mnemoc> inside chroot i need 'cc' to be dietlibc-aware
19:00 < rxr> for link?
19:00 < rxr> yes
19:00 < rxr> == 01/03/06 19:55:07 =[2]=> Aborted building package gcc.
19:01 < rxr> ouhm
19:02 < rxr> libtool: compile: unable to infer tagged configuration
19:02 < rxr> libtool: compile: specify a tag with `--tag'
19:02 < rxr> make[6]: *** [libsax_gcj_la-sax.lo] Error 1
19:02 < mnemoc> gcj?!
19:03 < mnemoc> that's greedy
19:05 < mnemoc> # cat build/sedu-2.1-stable-x86-pentium2-sedu//usr/bin/cc
19:05 < mnemoc> #!/bin/sh
19:05 < mnemoc> exec diet gcc ""
19:05 < mnemoc> well... it is diet aware
19:06 < rxr> hm ?
19:11 < morfoh> rxr: what do you think ... should we use a stripped down busybox for wrt2 or sth. different ?
19:12 < rxr> different
19:12 < rxr> I hate busybox like not much else ...
19:12 < morfoh> embutils and mininet need some hackery then ;)
19:13 < rxr> well for the start the full iproute / iptables would do ...
19:13 < rxr> e.g. you want more than I'll add to miniip anyway ...
19:13 < rxr> cu soon
19:13 < morfoh> cu
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19:17 < mnemoc> a real router/firewall needs full iproute2/iptables
19:17 < morfoh> mnemoc: ack
19:17 < mnemoc> $dietip should be only a udhcpc companion for initrd
19:20 < mnemoc> dietip sounds better than miniip
19:42 < mnemoc> jsaw: can you give me a hand with fl_wrapper under dietlibc?
19:43 < CIA-1> amery * r14449 /trunk/package/base/dietlibc/pkg_gcc_post.conf: * fixed typo on dietlibc's usr/bin/cc
19:46 < jsaw> re
19:47 < mnemoc> jsaw: hi!
19:47 < jsaw> xproto fails on x86-64 due to hardcoded lib path
19:47 < jsaw> :(
19:47 < jsaw> hi mnemoc :)
19:47 * jsaw hides
19:47 < jsaw> mnemoc: ask...
19:49 < mnemoc> jsaw: http://www.rafb.net/paste/results/LLxlVU91.html :)
19:49 < jsaw> oh,eh
19:49 < jsaw> ./scripts/Emerge-Pkg lynx ...
19:51 < jsaw> btw, I've just installed r14446, minimal+vserver
19:51 < mnemoc> working decently?
19:51 < jsaw> besides errors while emerging xorg-server, yes, flawlessly (though I have to test vserver still)
19:52 < jsaw> what's the problem with fl_wrapper
19:53 < jsaw> I only see warnings
19:53 < jsaw> no errors ?
19:53 < jsaw> (or I am blind)
19:53 < jsaw> ah
19:53 < jsaw> now
19:53 < mnemoc> utime
19:53 < jsaw> and exec*
19:54 * mnemoc is again the first in using $libc on $stagelevel -ge 1
19:55 < mnemoc> -gt *
19:57 < CIA-1> amery * r14450 /branches/2.1/package/base/dietlibc/pkg_gcc_post.conf: * merged 14449 from trunk: fixed typo on dietlibc's usr/bin/cc
19:58 < jsaw> mnemoc: fix utime in dietlibc
19:59 < jsaw> (only a const in front of the second argument)
20:01 < mnemoc> uh
20:01 < mnemoc> ok
20:01 < jsaw> mnemoc: same applies to execl and execle, but you should look at the POSIX standard, if dietlibc or gnulibc is correct
20:02 < jsaw> if diet is correct, you have to change fl_wrapper_exec*
20:02 < jsaw> :/
20:03 < mnemoc> for exec only, or utime too?
20:03 < mnemoc> ah, _if_
20:10 < CIA-1> jsaw * r14451 /trunk/package/base/rocknet/rocknet.conf: * sbindir is /sbin, not /usr/sbin
20:11 < mnemoc> oh
20:11 < mnemoc> jsaw: http://www.opengroup.org/onlinepubs/009695399/functions/exec.html
20:11 < mnemoc> which doesn't match 68 int execl(const char *path, ...) __THROW;
20:12 < jsaw> yep
20:12 < jsaw> dietlibc is wrong...
20:14 < jsaw> mnemoc: both patches upstream... :) (in case fefe is to be found somewhere)
20:14 < mnemoc> :)
20:19 < CIA-1> jsaw * r14452 /trunk/scripts/functions.in:
20:19 < CIA-1> * spit out warning if bogus paths are detected in .la files
20:19 < CIA-1> (-> LIBTOOL-QUIRK)
20:20 < CIA-1> jsaw * r14453 /trunk/package/xorg/xproto/xproto.conf: * app -p to mkdir, /usr/X11/lib does not necessarily exist on 64bit
20:24 < jsaw> which library has crack.h ???
20:24 < jsaw> libgcrypt.h ?
20:28 < karasz> re
20:28 < mnemoc> minute
20:28 < mnemoc> jsaw: not on 2.1/ref
20:28 < karasz> mnemoc, please tell me that that rafb is some wierd config you try ...
20:28 < karasz> please, please
20:28 -!- rene [n=rene@port-212-202-42-30.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #t2
20:29 -!- rene [n=rene@port-212-202-42-30.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Client Quit]
20:29 < mnemoc> karasz: non-crossbuilt dietlibc-based
20:29 < karasz> ok
20:29 < karasz> whoufff...
20:29 < jsaw> pam 0.99.2.1 asks for it
20:29 < rxr> hm
20:30 < jsaw> huh
20:30 < jsaw> it's glibc...
20:31 < mnemoc> o.o
20:31 < karasz> 14446...
20:31 < karasz> is that the answer to my prayers?
20:31 < rxr> damn linksysfirmware does not update dyndns.org correctly as it advertises to be able to
20:32 < jsaw> karasz: seems like
20:32 < karasz> oki....
20:32 < karasz> :D
20:33 < karasz> for now i will sto 2.1
20:33 < karasz> stop
20:33 < karasz> and retry trunk...:D
20:36 < jsaw> next question, where
20:36 < jsaw> 's crack.h
20:36 < rxr> jsaw: I also missed it
20:36 < jsaw> oh
20:36 < rxr> jsaw: maybe it is not installed with cracklib ?
20:36 < jsaw> no
20:36 < rxr> jsaw: who updated pam ?
20:36 < jsaw> noone yet
20:36 < rxr> jsaw: "not installed" that is in cracklib but missing on the system ..
20:36 < jsaw> I'm emerging
20:37 < rxr> jsaw: I mean I have cracklib but no crack.h ...
20:37 < jsaw> rxr: no, that means, it is not part of cracklib
20:37 < jsaw> no crack.h inside the sources either
20:37 < rxr> hm
20:37 < jsaw> does anybody have an older system running?
20:37 < mnemoc> 2.1
20:37 < rxr> maybe new version od that also ?
20:38 < rxr> gsmp is 2.0 ...
20:38 < mnemoc> which doesn't have any crack.h
20:39 < karasz> cracklib-2.7-28
20:40 < karasz> arts still fails...
20:41 < rxr> karasz: 2.1 ?
20:41 < karasz> no
20:41 < karasz> trunk
20:41 < karasz> returning to 2.1
20:41 < rxr> karasz: did you rebuidl at least gcc ?
20:41 < karasz> trunk?
20:41 < rxr> karasz: but I rebuild trunk from scratch on x86-64 on my hammer sub-notebook
20:42 < rxr> I can notify you when it builds a mostly complete desktop including kde ..
20:42 < karasz> ok
20:42 < karasz> till then buildin 2.1
20:43 < jsaw> o.O
20:44 < jsaw> .oO(where has crack.h gone)
20:44 < karasz> cracklib-2.7-28 has crack.h
20:49 < karasz> i dld cracklib-2.8.6 and it has that crack.h file in it
20:49 < rxr> hm - libtool junk:
20:49 < rxr> +# Darwin sucks
20:49 < rxr> +eval std_shrext=\"$shrext_cmds\"
20:49 < rxr> ...
20:52 < jsaw> karasz: where can I download?
20:52 < karasz> sf.net
20:52 < jsaw> oh
20:52 < karasz> you want just the h file?
20:53 < karasz> i can privide it...
20:53 < jsaw> no
20:53 < jsaw> the whole package
20:53 < jsaw> karasz: can u update cracklib to sf.net ?
20:53 < jsaw> ;) :) ;) :) ;)
20:53 < karasz> right now i cannot
20:54 < karasz> http://sourceforge.net/projects/cracklib
20:54 < jsaw> :(
20:54 < jsaw> (I know)
20:55 < rxr> ?
20:57 < jsaw> when karasz said sf.net, I immediately went to the url he wrote later
20:57 < mnemoc> i have a 'sf' keyword on firefox to http://sourceforge.net/search/?words=%s&type_of_search=soft :)
20:58 < mnemoc> keywords rule
20:58 < jsaw> how can I add that to lynx?
20:58 < mnemoc> wp,fm,sf,t2,go,leo
20:58 < mnemoc> jsaw: on elinks you can add your own extensions
20:59 < mnemoc> lynx sucks :p
21:00 < mnemoc> http://elinks.or.cz/ extensions on LUA :)
21:00 < mnemoc> or guile
21:02 < mnemoc> axion: is the account you gave on the offered 100MBps box?
21:02 < morfoh> re
21:03 < mnemoc> wb morfoh
21:04 < morfoh> thx mnemoc :)
21:05 < CIA-1> jsaw * r14454 /trunk/package/base/cracklib/ (cracklib.conf cracklib.desc fpic.patch):
21:05 < CIA-1> * update cracklib (2.7 -> 2.8.6)
21:05 < CIA-1> NOTE: needs to be checked (esp. the dictionaries)
21:06 < mnemoc> pam needs a fork
21:06 < mnemoc> current maintainers are harmful
21:06 < rxr> mnemoc: I complained to them
21:06 < mnemoc> and?
21:07 < rxr> they only replied I shoudl be happy that someone does all the hard working merging the patches and clean it up and I should not send them furter mail when I only wanna flame ...
21:07 < Baldzius> :)
21:07 < mnemoc> uhm
21:07 < jsaw> O.O
21:07 < mnemoc> morrons
21:08 < morfoh> a bad flamer this rxr is :p
21:08 < rxr> I have a hack for the libtol hack in gcc to make it build gch ...
21:08 < morfoh> anyway ... who the f* needs pam :p
21:09 < rxr> well - in big setups you need pam ...
21:10 < CIA-1> jsaw * r14455 /trunk/package/base/pam/ (5 files):
21:10 < CIA-1> * update pam (0.81 -> 0.99.2.1)
21:10 < CIA-1> NOTE: /etc/pam.d files must be supervised
21:12 < mnemoc> rxr: it was a joke from morfoh
21:13 < rxr> ah
21:13 < rxr> jsaw: where _must be_ means you do ?
21:13 < morfoh> mnemoc: I'm never joking ... o_-
21:14 < jsaw> rxr: I have it on my todo now, but if somebody else does ;)
21:14 < jsaw> (these where anyway wrong before)
21:14 < mnemoc> morfoh: :)
21:15 < CIA-1> rene * r14456 /trunk/package/base/gcc/libtool-junk-regen.patch:
21:15 < CIA-1> * fixed gcc/libtook-junk-regen.patch to be able to build java stuff
21:15 < CIA-1> should be sane but test build still running
21:15 < jsaw> now let's see if xorg-server builds
21:16 < rxr> subnotebook rebuild: -> Compiler Cache Hits while pkg build: 100.00% (475 hits, 0 misses)
21:16 < rxr> ^- binutils ...
21:16 < CIA-1> amery * r14457 /trunk/package/www/elinks/elinks.desc: * updated elinks (0.10.6 -> 0.11.0)
21:20 < morfoh> why does curl randomly fail on stage 5 ?
21:20 < rxr> when randomly most pARALLEL
21:20 < rxr> but usually built fo me ..
21:21 < jsaw> rxr: could you review the Xorg installation on 64bit system, please? The paths in lib{,64}/X11/* especially. And, should /etc/X11 also go to xproto?
21:21 < rxr> et/X11 could go to xproto, yes
21:22 < rxr> on the RC4 or so builds lib64 looked good what issue do you have _
21:23 < jsaw> should the fonts really go to lib64/, or should the link go from lib64 to lib, for example
21:23 < rxr> hm - that would be an idea
21:23 < jsaw> next, xproto creates a fonts link, which does not exist
21:23 < rxr> even better would be to have the fonts in shared/ in any case ...
21:24 < rxr> share/ even ...
21:24 < jsaw> okay, I'll change xproto now...
21:25 < CIA-1> jsaw * r14458 /trunk/package/xorg/xorg-server/modular-x-conf.in: * add lib64/X11/app-defaults directories handling
21:27 < jsaw> rxr: what's about "locale", lib/X11 or lib64/X11 ?
21:29 < jsaw> rxr: fonts in share/fonts or share/X11/fonts ?
21:32 < rxr> hey - rock linux bof stuff, summary:
21:32 < rxr> * There will no longer be any "ROCK Linux" releases.
21:32 < rxr> * A security team will be formed (currently consisting of daja who is
21:32 < rxr> responsible for paving the way things will be handled)
21:32 < rxr> * Dealing with a massively outdated trunk
21:33 < morfoh> mnemoc: does 1-bzip2 fails on your dietsedu ?
21:34 < mnemoc> not after the last fix
21:35 < morfoh> ok ... thanks ;)
21:35 < morfoh> will try
21:40 < rxr> the 3.5 kmail is phantastic ... ,-)
21:41 < morfoh> rxr: why ? what makes you that happy ? :)
21:42 < jsaw> rxr: oh, here I found a strange link, /usr/lib/X11 points to /usr/X11/lib.
21:42 < jsaw> rxr: shouldn`t it point to /usr/X11/lib/X11 ?
21:49 < rxr> jsaw: hm
21:49 < rxr> do not rember what old apps neded for compat
21:50 < rxr> -> Compiler Cache Hits while pkg build: 45.14% (1031 hits, 1253 misses)
21:50 < rxr> -> Cleaning up ccache ...
21:50 < rxr> -> $root/var/adm/logs/2-gcc.out -> 2-gcc.log
21:50 < rxr> == 01/03/06 23:29:59 =[2]=> Finished building package gcc.
21:53 < rxr> x86-64
21:54 * mnemoc wonder what is he doing on dietlibc code
21:55 < rxr> mnemoc: ?
21:56 < mnemoc> POSIXing execl and execle
21:56 < mnemoc> to get fl_wrapper build against it
21:57 < mnemoc> but i'm have loosed lot of C skills in the last years
21:59 < mnemoc> and this ' ' indentation is also unnatural to me
22:07 < rxr> 2-gcc passed on the ppc64 now as well
22:15 < CIA-1> jsaw * r14459 /trunk/package/xorg/xproto/xproto.conf:
22:15 < CIA-1> * create /usr/X11/share/fonts directory and create appropriate links
22:15 < CIA-1> * create /etc/X11/app-defaults directory and links accordingly
22:16 < CIA-1> jsaw * r14460 /trunk/misc/target/initrd.in: * do real cpio unpacking, then extend and repack
22:20 < jsaw> rxr: can you test input-match again, I commited an untested fixx
22:21 < rxr> jsaw: tomorrow
22:21 < jsaw> whenever :)
22:21 < rxr> I'm about to sleep as soon as the ppc64 build hit stage 5 there are so chances I get a more complete system tomorrow ..
22:21 < rxr> e.g. one with a graphical browser that is more mature than links -g
22:21 < mnemoc> rxr: please, give me a minute before that
22:21 < nzg> rxr: the ibook you had in frankfurt, was it 12" or 14"
22:21 * jsaw is also waiting to get a gui on his system
22:22 < rxr> hm
22:22 < rxr> I had no iBook in frankfurt
22:22 < rxr> susan hat a 12" and valentin a 14"
22:22 < rxr> had
22:22 < nzg> i mean susans then *g*
22:22 < nzg> ok
22:22 < rxr> mnemoc: yes ?
22:23 < rxr> 3-gettext on the ppc64, you have a few minutes left
22:23 < rxr> cool
22:23 < mnemoc> rxr: http://www.rafb.net/paste/results/ZVESp539.html
22:23 < rxr> x86-64 is at 5-glibc
22:25 < rxr> mnemoc: and I should ack the patch ?
22:26 < mnemoc> ESC[32;1m->ESC[0m Reading package configuration from package directory.
22:26 < mnemoc> ESC[32;1m->ESC[0m Preparing build in src.binutils.sedu.20060103.191847.21440.builder
22:26 < mnemoc> sort: write error: Bad file number
22:26 < mnemoc> sort: write error: Bad file number
22:26 < mnemoc> sort: write error: Bad file number
22:26 < mnemoc> is that my fault?
22:26 < rxr> no - that Is what I see here as well
22:26 < rxr> sort and sed are b0rked ...
22:27 < mnemoc> after that patch i got fl_wrapper built for dietlibc...
22:27 < rxr> nice
22:27 < rxr> but I can not ackk it with scrolling over ..
22:27 < mnemoc> compiles 0 warnings :p
22:27 < rxr> either commit if it works for you or wait till tomorrow afternoon (need to do comercial work in the morning)
22:27 < mnemoc> ok
22:27 < mnemoc> i'll commit
22:28 < rxr> ok
22:28 < rxr> 3-coreutils
22:28 < jsaw> if, then what imap servers are you running?
22:28 < mnemoc> bincimap
22:28 < rxr> bincimap
22:28 < mnemoc> :)
22:28 < jsaw> support for imaps?
22:28 < morfoh> bincimap seems to be the most popular here :p
22:28 < mnemoc> bincimap doesn't care about that
22:29 < rxr> I tunnel via ssh ..
22:29 < rxr> no public imap port ...
22:29 < jsaw> hmmm
22:30 < jsaw> and which smtp server?
22:30 < mnemoc> qmail :p
22:30 < morfoh> :)
22:30 < mnemoc> jsaw: bincimap is designed for tcpserver, similar to xinitd
22:31 < jsaw> how do I add a secure connection there?
22:31 < jsaw> besides tunneling ssh?
22:31 < morfoh> stunnel in front ?
22:32 < rxr> IT: Bjarne Stroustrup Previews C++0x
22:32 < rxr> ^- on various news sites ...
22:32 < mnemoc> or TLS, which is supported
22:33 < rxr> http://www.macintouch.com/reliability/laptops.html
22:33 < mnemoc> otool, also works fine
22:34 < mnemoc> bah
22:34 < mnemoc> not otool
22:34 < mnemoc> too much heat
22:35 < jsaw> I need firefox to read the docu...
22:35 < morfoh> mnemoc: where are you sitting ? ;)
22:35 < mnemoc> 36°C outside, and laptop at 68°C
22:36 * morfoh hopes mnemoc hasn't gone to hell yet :p
22:36 < mnemoc> this dell laptop is literaly hot
22:37 < morfoh> dell hell
22:38 < morfoh> mnemoc: if you're that deep into diet code now ... pls go and fix the mips support ... and if you have some more sparetime add dynamic linking too ;)
22:39 < mnemoc> i prefer sed/sort by now
22:41 < jsaw> rxr: you use svn via apache, right?
22:41 < rxr> !> pam_pass.c:36: error: 'PAM_SUCCESS' undeclared (first us ..
22:41 < rxr> jsaw: yes
22:41 < rxr> but we have read only svn://
22:41 < jsaw> rxr: ????
22:41 < mnemoc> jsaw: apache is the only way to get svn via http
22:41 < jsaw> PAM_SUCCES ... ?
22:42 < jsaw> I`m only interested in https... so I have to install apache...
22:43 < jsaw> rxr: compiled in-system...
22:44 < jsaw> oh, btw, flat file layout for svn, or db, rxr?
22:45 < jsaw> mnemoc: what stuff are you running usually inside a vserver?
22:45 < morfoh> jsaw: you yan run whole systems within it
22:45 < mnemoc> jsaw: mnemosyne-based distributions
22:45 < morfoh> I run mailservers
22:45 < morfoh> within vservers
22:48 -!- rene [n=rene@port-212-202-42-30.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #t2
22:48 -!- rene [n=rene@port-212-202-42-30.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Client Quit]
22:49 < rxr> jsaw: i use db
22:49 < rxr> since when we started there was just db
22:49 < CIA-1> amery * r14461 /trunk/package/base/dietlibc/posixfy_utime_execl_execle.patch: * changed dietlibc to have POSIX utime, execl and execle. (tested on 2.1)
22:49 < rxr> now i might choose fsfs - after deep testing. ...
22:49 < mnemoc> fsfs is nice
22:49 < morfoh> jsaw: but now they recommend fsfs
22:49 < jsaw> I somehow think db is faster then spilling cache with directories, or?
22:50 < rxr> pam: usr/include/pam_appl.h
22:50 < jsaw> ?
22:50 < morfoh> jsaw: no! fsfs is faster
22:50 < rxr> ../lib/pam_defs.h:1:31: error: security/pam_appl.h: No such file or directory
22:50 < rxr> ../lib/pam_defs.h:2:31: error: security/pam_misc.h: No such file or directory
22:50 < rxr> suckers
22:50 < jsaw> ...
22:50 < mnemoc> fsfs is faster, and per revision _file_
22:51 < jsaw> isn't that wasting a lot of disk space?
22:51 < mnemoc> not really
22:51 < mnemoc> reiserfs is your friend :)
22:51 < rxr> /usr/include/pam_appl.h:23:75: error: security/_pam_types.h: No such file or dir
22:51 < rxr> In file included from ../lib/pam_defs.h:1,
22:51 < mnemoc> .oO
22:51 < jsaw> mnemoc: I have ext3
22:51 < rxr> jsaw: what the hell have you commited there ...
22:51 < rxr> jsaw: oh ext3 is a bad choice
22:52 < morfoh> mnemoc: reiserfs is your friend till it decides to not like you anymore :p
22:52 < rxr> in nearly any regard but backward compat ...
22:52 < jsaw> rxr: it worked here (TM) .o(damn)
22:52 < rxr> jsaw: in system emerge with old, sane files around ?
22:52 < mnemoc> rxr is reiserfs_4_ powered
22:52 < jsaw> rxr: seems like...
22:52 < mnemoc> jsaw: if you have time, please take a look into 14461
22:53 < rxr> mnemoc: not yet
22:53 < jsaw> rxr: maybe revert, then I'll try to fix it
22:53 < rxr> mnemoc: just a test-spin and it looked very promising ...
22:53 < mnemoc> jsaw: i need an ack from one of you before sending upstream
22:55 < jsaw> mnemoc: looks perfect if u ask me
22:55 < rxr> mnemoc: dietlibc ?
22:55 < mnemoc> rxr: yes
22:55 < rxr> jsaw: maybe due to setting a libdir variable that overwites some Makefile internal =?
22:56 < mnemoc> rxr: what have you plan about sort and sed?
22:56 < jsaw> no idea...
22:56 < rxr> mnemoc: debug it one day
22:56 < rxr> this stuff I usually leave for lovely rainy sundays ...
22:56 < jsaw> so most (all?) are happy with reiserfs?
22:57 < rxr> I can priority it if you want ...
22:57 < rxr> jsaw: I never lost a file due reiser and I run it everywhere sine before linux 2.4.0 ...
22:57 < mnemoc> rxr: well... i need it :(
22:57 < rxr> I tried reiser4 around x-mas and it was astonishing fast, even way faster than reiser3 ...
22:57 < rxr> mnemoc: need as in $$$ due ti ?
22:58 < jsaw> rxr: we have reiserfs4 support in t2
22:58 < jsaw> ?
22:58 < mnemoc> rxr: well... yes :p
22:58 < rxr> huh ?
22:58 < rxr> jsaw: yes thru linux26mm
22:58 < jsaw> oh
22:58 < rxr> jsaw: but reiser4 I would not recommend for production right now
22:58 < mnemoc> rxr: but i could make a glibc router/firewall/fubar for the client
22:59 < rxr> too much changes lately to get it into linux26mm - I would wait until Hans Reiser got it thru his torture tests againa ...
22:59 < jsaw> ic
23:01 < rxr> jsaw: I moved the pam files into a security sub-dir for now manually ..
23:01 < rxr> shadow builds then ...
23:01 < jsaw> .oO
23:02 < rxr> I leave it for someone to clean that up - or I'll do tomorrow late afternoon on the next test spin
23:02 < jsaw> I start a fresh build tomorrow and correct the errors...
23:02 < rxr> right now I want to get the ppc64 into stage5 and enter sleep
23:03 < CIA-1> jsaw * r14462 /trunk/package/xorg/xorg-server/xorg-server.conf: * remove app-defaults directory creation, it's in xproto now
23:07 * mnemoc moving home
23:08 < rxr> cu mnemoc
23:08 < mnemoc> cu :)
23:08 < morfoh> mnemoc: move quickly ;)
23:08 < morfoh> cu
23:08 < CIA-1> jsaw * r14463 /trunk/package/base/cron/00-updates.cron: * add /user to paths omitted for locatedb
23:09 < rxr> /user ?
23:10 < demian> f*ck, vacation are over :(
23:10 < jsaw> rxr: some larger networks use this path instead of home. home gets the automatic link to the appropriate path, depending on which computer you log in
23:11 < jsaw> like, you decide, you want a local directory on this computer, but a network wide (from storage center) on other computers
23:12 < rxr> jsaw: hm - wonders if it realy should be in vanilla t2 ...
23:12 < jsaw> If I want to promote it to the admins of my institute, yes ;)
23:13 < morfoh> jsaw: good tactic ;)
23:13 < rxr> jsaw: har har
23:13 < jsaw> btw, rxr, please send me the tex files for your presentation
23:13 < jsaw> I'll gonna have one during the next month
23:14 < rxr> jsaw: remind me tomorrow and I do
23:14 < jsaw> :)
23:14 < rxr> oh - we still have rockplug in trunk
23:14 < jsaw> has time, have no private email currently...
23:14 < jsaw> rxr: remove it
23:14 < jsaw> dot-stop
23:15 < rxr> hotplug as welle ?
23:16 < CIA-1> rene * r14464 /trunk/package/base/rockplug/: * removed rockplug, it is End Of Live, we replaced it with hotplug++
23:18 < jsaw> rxr: I woudn't, but X -> O, and move to attic/
23:18 < jsaw> for now
23:18 < rxr> There is dkms-qvm86 which is an open source accelerator, not as fast as kqemu, but it works well.
23:18 < rxr>
23:18 < rxr> ^- qemu ?
23:20 < rxr> ah - ppc64 finally at 5-glibc ..
23:20 < rxr> bed now in seconds
23:20 < morfoh> gn8 rxr
23:20 < rxr> and glibc finished on x86-64
23:20 < rxr> -> Compiler Cache Hits while pkg build: 98.55% (4221 hits, 62 misses)
23:20 < rxr> how I like our ccache impl.
23:21 < morfoh> :)
23:21 < rxr> http://savannah.nongnu.org/projects/qvm86/
23:23 < rxr> guess I'll try that some time soon
23:23 < rxr> n8 alll
23:23 < jsaw> cu rxr
23:30 < karasz> re
23:30 < karasz> cu rxr
23:30 < karasz> .oO(someone that i didn't greeted yet?)
23:31 < karasz> moin axion Baldzius demian jsaw morfoh mtr nzg owl valentin zod
23:31 < Baldzius> :))
23:31 < Baldzius> moin karasz :)
23:31 < morfoh> moin karasz ;)
23:32 < karasz> konichiwa morfoh san
23:32 < jsaw> cache is indeed nice, all x86-input-* have around 10 to 11 hits (of ~40)
23:32 < jsaw> karasz: :)
23:32 < nzg> moin karasz
23:33 < jsaw> I'm going into background mode (and relax my squared eyes a bit)
23:34 < morfoh> jsaw: have fun! :)
23:35 < demian> hi karasz
23:35 < karasz> ogenki desu ka morfoh san?
23:36 < morfoh> karasz: what is your problem ? ;) but I guess you want me to ask how I am ...
23:37 < morfoh> I don't share yours and mnemoc's love speaking japanese ? ;)
23:37 < karasz> hint: Ee, genki desu.
23:37 < morfoh> not yet ...
23:37 < karasz> in time morfoh , in time
23:37 < morfoh> :)
23:39 < morfoh> karasz: should I try to lower your mood ? :)
23:39 < karasz> you can't
23:39 * karasz putting on anti mood lowering shild
23:39 < morfoh> karasz: let's see ! how is your target going ?
23:39 * morfoh hides
23:39 < karasz> Arigatoo gozaimasu morfoh san...
23:40 < karasz> in fact stable behaves as it is expected
23:40 < morfoh> :)
23:40 < karasz> boring but stable...
23:41 < morfoh> karasz: you can build up a small sandbox using vserver or so ... for your tries to run "cutting" edge trunk stuff ;)
23:42 < karasz> let's see...
23:42 < karasz> i guess it will be top priority number 3
23:42 < karasz> sorry but first two are taken :)
23:42 < morfoh> and I guess you've nothing against a stable working environment too
23:43 < karasz> no, actualy no
23:47 < karasz> hehe
23:47 < karasz> knowledge perl of the day....
23:48 < karasz> in Japan there were no waitresses as we know it before europeans brought them in
23:48 < karasz> so there is no word for waitress in japanese
23:48 < karasz> they borrowed one : `ueitoresu`
--- Log closed Wed Jan 04 00:00:42 2006