T2 IRC Log: 2006-05-19
This is the log as captured by an IRC bot in the channel. The statements are those of the individual people and might not neccessarily reflect the policy and legal rules as set forth by the T2 SDE Project.
--- Log opened Fri May 19 00:00:15 2006
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07:52 < rxr_> morfoh: 18:10 < morfoh> rxr: by repeating false information again and again the
07:52 < rxr_> information will not become true ... and sorry the current
07:52 < rxr_> issue has nothing to do with your assumption for being
07:52 < rxr_> connected with the issue you tried to show here ... and I think
07:52 < rxr_> you've never thought about your subtile way of bashing people
07:52 < rxr_> you dislike while writing mails to the ML
07:53 -!- You're now known as rxr
07:53 < rxr> morfoh: what false information do you talk about and there was no bashing in my mails to the list
07:53 < rxr> the bashing was started by the replys
07:56 < rxr> and btw. I'll no longer hang much around in
07:56 < rxr> #t2, the last months communication behaviour of some people makes me sick
08:17 < valentin> moin
08:17 < valentin> moin rxr
08:18 < valentin> morfoh, rxr: i don't think by pointing fingers things will turn better.
08:26 < rxr> sure not, as doesn't ranting all the days
08:56 < valentin> good point. so maybe just stop it
08:56 < valentin> (sounds agressive, but is not meant to be agressive)
09:01 < valentin> we should split that chan into #t2-devel and #t2-community soon....
09:01 < valentin> so we have a pure channel for development issues
09:01 < valentin> maybe this would calm the waves a bit
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10:07 < morfoh> valentin: read my last mails and the replies on it carefully and you'll see. It's a real pitty, I just expressed my frustration about the deletion of a package with the wish for better communication. tAnd believe me, here is no direct or hidden connection to the issue nearly 2 month ago. And btw, what do you want to solve with splitting up a channel and what should it calm down ? You know better that it won't. I guess You know the problem quite well
10:11 < valentin> hi morfoh
10:11 < morfoh> valentin: the only issues I wanted to talk about are the style of communication and the way of taking project related decissions.
10:11 < morfoh> hi valentin :)
10:11 < valentin> as you can guess, this split thing is not to be taken too serious
10:11 < morfoh> valentin: of course it can't
10:11 < valentin> i just wanted to express my wish that discussions should focus on content rather than on style
10:11 < morfoh> ;)
10:12 < valentin> i don't know the reason why discussions heat up that fast here
10:12 < valentin> but everyone seems to have problems to stay rational
10:12 < morfoh> valentin: but a minimal amount of respect should be within every style
10:12 < valentin> and that 'who pisses whom' discussion leads to nowhere
10:12 < valentin> morfoh: yes
10:14 < valentin> a problem is, that criticism is taken to personal when talking here. for example phrases like "which idiot broke XYZ" is a personal insult to the person who did
10:15 < valentin> as i understand, rxr is quite frustrated because of stuff like that and you are quite frustrated, because he doesn't ask you for feedback anymore. right ?
10:16 < morfoh> valentin: it's a matter of respect for me to ask the package maintainer before deleting a package. and _not_ on IRC.
10:17 < valentin> we have svn revert ;)
10:18 < valentin> well, my package kopete was deleted by someone else without asking, but that was okay because it had a reason
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10:19 < morfoh> valentin: ack ... this was a good example for bad behavior of me ;)
10:19 < morfoh> valentin: but I guess we discussed that issue in a quite friendly way
10:20 < valentin> sure
10:20 < valentin> somehow the voice between you three got a bit more unfriendly. steadily.
10:20 < valentin> and i do not want to analyze that, because you are all grown ups and i am just a channel lurker
10:22 < morfoh> valentin: I even had the opposite impression the last weeks. of course the situation was heated up 6-7weeks ago
10:23 < rxr> morfoh: why of course? what was 6-7 weeks ago ?
10:23 < valentin> back to the current reason i understand rxr, he is quite overworked and under preassure to get more t2 pr and this means release fast.
10:28 < morfoh> valentin: that's completely understandable, but what I wanted to point out is the style of communication and the way on taking decissions. And I think this should be discussable within a project.
10:29 < valentin> morfoh: so here is your chance. any better Roadmap that is realistic ?
10:29 < rxr> morfoh: thanks for answering
10:30 * rxr away - cu
10:30 < morfoh> valentin: I really think that this is not a real topic for IRC.
10:30 < morfoh> cu rxr
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10:31 < morfoh> valentin: I mean starting a thread on ML doesn't hurt
10:31 < valentin> sure
10:31 < valentin> bbl
10:31 < morfoh> valentin: cu
10:40 < rxr> though one more note, I first proposed a "2.2.0 release schedule" 10 days ago, and noone replied
10:40 < rxr> but now I'm catching the next bus
11:28 < CIA-7> rene * r17526 /trunk/scripts/Build-Tools: * more options for uname to fix 3-perl regression
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12:07 -!- karasz is now known as fist_o
12:07 -!- fist_o is now known as fist_o_rage
12:08 < fist_o_rage> moin.
12:10 < mnemoc> moin :)
12:13 < fist_o_rage> moin mnemoc
12:17 -!- fist_o_rage is now known as karasz
12:17 < mnemoc> no quote of the day?
12:17 < karasz> no.
12:17 < mnemoc> :(
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12:21 < Baldzius> moin
12:22 < mnemoc> wb Baldzius!
12:22 < Baldzius> hi mnemoc :)
12:24 < morfoh> hi tavarish karasz
12:24 < morfoh> hi Baldzius :)
12:24 < karasz> mooin Baldzius
12:25 < karasz> kommrad...wb
12:25 < Baldzius> hi morfoh & karasz :)
12:25 < morfoh> thx :)
12:38 -!- karasz is now known as fist_o_rage
12:40 < CIA-7> susan * r17527 /trunk/package/gnome2/totem/totem.desc: * updated totem (1.4.0 -> 1.4.1)
13:07 < fist_o_rage> mnemoc: unregistered nicks cannot use query
13:07 < mnemoc> :(
13:07 < mnemoc> register it ,-)
13:08 < mnemoc> after that you can link both
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15:36 < fist_o_rage> bbl
15:36 < fist_o_rage> cu
15:40 < mnemoc> cu karasz
16:08 < CIA-7> chris * r17528 /trunk/package/security/prelude-lml/prelude-lml.desc: * updated prelude-lml (0.9.4 -> 0.9.5)
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16:58 < fist_o_rage> re
17:00 < morfoh> wb fist_o_maniac :)
17:01 < fist_o_rage> thx kommrad morfoh
17:02 < morfoh> fist_o_maniac: what do you try to express with your nick ? :)
17:02 * fist_o_rage moving in background
17:02 < morfoh> what are you doing in background mode ?
17:03 < _Ragnar_> o_o
17:03 < fist_o_rage> reading, writting docu and such enlightening activities.
17:09 < morfoh> bbl
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19:14 < fist_o_rage> wb
19:30 < morfoh> fist_o_manic :)
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19:50 < fist_o_rage> hmm, why do you keep on calling me manic?
19:50 < morfoh> fist_o_rage: no particular reason :p
19:51 < fist_o_rage> ahum, ok.
20:24 -!- fist_o_rage is now known as karasz
20:25 < morfoh> karasz: thanks tavarish :)
20:25 < karasz> hm?
20:26 < mnemoc> we don't want *rage around ,-)
20:26 < karasz> hmmm, i don't think that i acted like i felt, but if i did sorry.
20:28 * karasz wonders what did fisy_o_rage do to become unwanted around....
20:28 < mnemoc> nah, i was just teasing you
20:28 < karasz> same here ;)
20:28 < mnemoc> :(
20:39 * karasz wonders where did he saw last time the days fast forward button...
20:40 < mnemoc> please don'T press it, i'm already late :(
20:41 < karasz> have no fear companero, i haven't found it
20:41 < karasz> ... yet
20:41 < mnemoc> gracias camarada
20:41 < mnemoc> :(
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22:23 < CIA-7> amery * r17529 /trunk/package/xorg/ (fixesproto/fixesproto.desc libxfixes/libxfixes.desc):
22:23 < CIA-7> * downdated libxfixes (4.0 -> 3.0.1.2) - it breaks gtk apps (runtime) badly
22:23 < CIA-7> * downdated fixesproto (4.0 -> 3.0.2) - it breaks gtk apps (runtime) badly
22:24 < _Ragnar_> O_O
22:25 < mnemoc> _Ragnar_: hi, have you built uclibc based targets on trunk reciently?
22:26 < _Ragnar_> no >.<
22:26 < _Ragnar_> no time really
22:27 < mnemoc> :(
22:27 < _Ragnar_> why?
22:28 < mnemoc> because my tries have failed dramaticly and i wanted to know if it was a general problem or just failing for me
22:28 < _Ragnar_> likely general problem >.< uclibc is a big mess
22:29 < mnemoc> :)
22:30 < _Ragnar_> I tried to get a recent sendmail to work with it, but I couldn't get it to resolve anything
22:30 < mnemoc> oh
22:31 < _Ragnar_> how is dietlibc these days?
22:32 < mnemoc> not better if you want to make a not cross-build build
22:33 < mnemoc> without perl you can't build autocrap on stage2 and everything goes to hell :(
22:33 < _Ragnar_> >.< sucks
22:33 < mnemoc> and i have been unable to allocate time for that :\
22:34 < _Ragnar_> yea :/
22:34 < _Ragnar_> always too little time
22:35 < mnemoc> yep :(
22:35 < karasz> mnemoc: kommrad is not around? or is he ignoring me ? ;)
22:36 < mnemoc> just ignoring you :)
22:36 < _Ragnar_> o_o
22:36 < karasz> :) thought so
22:36 < mnemoc> :)
22:39 < _Ragnar_> so what are you up to these days?
22:41 < mnemoc> in what field? :)
22:42 < _Ragnar_> in general
22:44 < mnemoc> difficult question :p
22:45 < _Ragnar_> why? :)
22:45 < mnemoc> because i'm too tired to think :p
22:58 -!- rxr_ [n=rene@e178189181.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #t2
22:58 -!- Topic for #t2: T2 | 2.1.1.1 and 2.2.0-epsilon RELEASED! | The System Development Environment (SDE) | http://www.t2-project.org/ | Say hello and do not hesitate to ask us any questions that you may have. | http://www.rafb.net/paste/
22:58 -!- Topic set by mnemoc [] [Sat Mar 11 22:55:45 2006]
22:58 [Users #t2]
22:58 [@ChanServ ] [ dsoul ] [ michal`] [ mtr ] [ sepp_ ] [ _Ragnar_]
22:58 [ Baldzius_] [ karasz] [ mnemoc ] [ rxr ] [ tdi ]
22:58 [ CIA-7 ] [ laj ] [ morfoh ] [ rxr_] [ valentin]
22:58 -!- Irssi: #t2: Total of 16 nicks [1 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 15 normal]
22:58 -!- [freenode-info] please register your nickname...don't forget to auto-identify! http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#nicksetup
22:58 -!- Channel #t2 created Sun Aug 8 19:15:33 2004
22:59 -!- Irssi: Join to #t2 was synced in 31 secs
23:07 < karasz> cu all later
23:07 < karasz> bye
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23:09 < mnemoc> cu karasz
--- Log closed Sat May 20 00:00:21 2006
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07:52 < rxr_> morfoh: 18:10 < morfoh> rxr: by repeating false information again and again the
07:52 < rxr_> information will not become true ... and sorry the current
07:52 < rxr_> issue has nothing to do with your assumption for being
07:52 < rxr_> connected with the issue you tried to show here ... and I think
07:52 < rxr_> you've never thought about your subtile way of bashing people
07:52 < rxr_> you dislike while writing mails to the ML
07:53 -!- You're now known as rxr
07:53 < rxr> morfoh: what false information do you talk about and there was no bashing in my mails to the list
07:53 < rxr> the bashing was started by the replys
07:56 < rxr> and btw. I'll no longer hang much around in
07:56 < rxr> #t2, the last months communication behaviour of some people makes me sick
08:17 < valentin> moin
08:17 < valentin> moin rxr
08:18 < valentin> morfoh, rxr: i don't think by pointing fingers things will turn better.
08:26 < rxr> sure not, as doesn't ranting all the days
08:56 < valentin> good point. so maybe just stop it
08:56 < valentin> (sounds agressive, but is not meant to be agressive)
09:01 < valentin> we should split that chan into #t2-devel and #t2-community soon....
09:01 < valentin> so we have a pure channel for development issues
09:01 < valentin> maybe this would calm the waves a bit
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10:07 < morfoh> valentin: read my last mails and the replies on it carefully and you'll see. It's a real pitty, I just expressed my frustration about the deletion of a package with the wish for better communication. tAnd believe me, here is no direct or hidden connection to the issue nearly 2 month ago. And btw, what do you want to solve with splitting up a channel and what should it calm down ? You know better that it won't. I guess You know the problem quite well
10:11 < valentin> hi morfoh
10:11 < morfoh> valentin: the only issues I wanted to talk about are the style of communication and the way of taking project related decissions.
10:11 < morfoh> hi valentin :)
10:11 < valentin> as you can guess, this split thing is not to be taken too serious
10:11 < morfoh> valentin: of course it can't
10:11 < valentin> i just wanted to express my wish that discussions should focus on content rather than on style
10:11 < morfoh> ;)
10:12 < valentin> i don't know the reason why discussions heat up that fast here
10:12 < valentin> but everyone seems to have problems to stay rational
10:12 < morfoh> valentin: but a minimal amount of respect should be within every style
10:12 < valentin> and that 'who pisses whom' discussion leads to nowhere
10:12 < valentin> morfoh: yes
10:14 < valentin> a problem is, that criticism is taken to personal when talking here. for example phrases like "which idiot broke XYZ" is a personal insult to the person who did
10:15 < valentin> as i understand, rxr is quite frustrated because of stuff like that and you are quite frustrated, because he doesn't ask you for feedback anymore. right ?
10:16 < morfoh> valentin: it's a matter of respect for me to ask the package maintainer before deleting a package. and _not_ on IRC.
10:17 < valentin> we have svn revert ;)
10:18 < valentin> well, my package kopete was deleted by someone else without asking, but that was okay because it had a reason
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10:19 < morfoh> valentin: ack ... this was a good example for bad behavior of me ;)
10:19 < morfoh> valentin: but I guess we discussed that issue in a quite friendly way
10:20 < valentin> sure
10:20 < valentin> somehow the voice between you three got a bit more unfriendly. steadily.
10:20 < valentin> and i do not want to analyze that, because you are all grown ups and i am just a channel lurker
10:22 < morfoh> valentin: I even had the opposite impression the last weeks. of course the situation was heated up 6-7weeks ago
10:23 < rxr> morfoh: why of course? what was 6-7 weeks ago ?
10:23 < valentin> back to the current reason i understand rxr, he is quite overworked and under preassure to get more t2 pr and this means release fast.
10:28 < morfoh> valentin: that's completely understandable, but what I wanted to point out is the style of communication and the way on taking decissions. And I think this should be discussable within a project.
10:29 < valentin> morfoh: so here is your chance. any better Roadmap that is realistic ?
10:29 < rxr> morfoh: thanks for answering
10:30 * rxr away - cu
10:30 < morfoh> valentin: I really think that this is not a real topic for IRC.
10:30 < morfoh> cu rxr
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10:31 < morfoh> valentin: I mean starting a thread on ML doesn't hurt
10:31 < valentin> sure
10:31 < valentin> bbl
10:31 < morfoh> valentin: cu
10:40 < rxr> though one more note, I first proposed a "2.2.0 release schedule" 10 days ago, and noone replied
10:40 < rxr> but now I'm catching the next bus
11:28 < CIA-7> rene * r17526 /trunk/scripts/Build-Tools: * more options for uname to fix 3-perl regression
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12:08 < fist_o_rage> moin.
12:10 < mnemoc> moin :)
12:13 < fist_o_rage> moin mnemoc
12:17 -!- fist_o_rage is now known as karasz
12:17 < mnemoc> no quote of the day?
12:17 < karasz> no.
12:17 < mnemoc> :(
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12:21 < Baldzius> moin
12:22 < mnemoc> wb Baldzius!
12:22 < Baldzius> hi mnemoc :)
12:24 < morfoh> hi tavarish karasz
12:24 < morfoh> hi Baldzius :)
12:24 < karasz> mooin Baldzius
12:25 < karasz> kommrad...wb
12:25 < Baldzius> hi morfoh & karasz :)
12:25 < morfoh> thx :)
12:38 -!- karasz is now known as fist_o_rage
12:40 < CIA-7> susan * r17527 /trunk/package/gnome2/totem/totem.desc: * updated totem (1.4.0 -> 1.4.1)
13:07 < fist_o_rage> mnemoc: unregistered nicks cannot use query
13:07 < mnemoc> :(
13:07 < mnemoc> register it ,-)
13:08 < mnemoc> after that you can link both
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15:36 < fist_o_rage> bbl
15:36 < fist_o_rage> cu
15:40 < mnemoc> cu karasz
16:08 < CIA-7> chris * r17528 /trunk/package/security/prelude-lml/prelude-lml.desc: * updated prelude-lml (0.9.4 -> 0.9.5)
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16:58 < fist_o_rage> re
17:00 < morfoh> wb fist_o_maniac :)
17:01 < fist_o_rage> thx kommrad morfoh
17:02 < morfoh> fist_o_maniac: what do you try to express with your nick ? :)
17:02 * fist_o_rage moving in background
17:02 < morfoh> what are you doing in background mode ?
17:03 < _Ragnar_> o_o
17:03 < fist_o_rage> reading, writting docu and such enlightening activities.
17:09 < morfoh> bbl
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19:14 < fist_o_rage> wb
19:30 < morfoh> fist_o_manic :)
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19:50 < fist_o_rage> hmm, why do you keep on calling me manic?
19:50 < morfoh> fist_o_rage: no particular reason :p
19:51 < fist_o_rage> ahum, ok.
20:24 -!- fist_o_rage is now known as karasz
20:25 < morfoh> karasz: thanks tavarish :)
20:25 < karasz> hm?
20:26 < mnemoc> we don't want *rage around ,-)
20:26 < karasz> hmmm, i don't think that i acted like i felt, but if i did sorry.
20:28 * karasz wonders what did fisy_o_rage do to become unwanted around....
20:28 < mnemoc> nah, i was just teasing you
20:28 < karasz> same here ;)
20:28 < mnemoc> :(
20:39 * karasz wonders where did he saw last time the days fast forward button...
20:40 < mnemoc> please don'T press it, i'm already late :(
20:41 < karasz> have no fear companero, i haven't found it
20:41 < karasz> ... yet
20:41 < mnemoc> gracias camarada
20:41 < mnemoc> :(
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22:23 < CIA-7> amery * r17529 /trunk/package/xorg/ (fixesproto/fixesproto.desc libxfixes/libxfixes.desc):
22:23 < CIA-7> * downdated libxfixes (4.0 -> 3.0.1.2) - it breaks gtk apps (runtime) badly
22:23 < CIA-7> * downdated fixesproto (4.0 -> 3.0.2) - it breaks gtk apps (runtime) badly
22:24 < _Ragnar_> O_O
22:25 < mnemoc> _Ragnar_: hi, have you built uclibc based targets on trunk reciently?
22:26 < _Ragnar_> no >.<
22:26 < _Ragnar_> no time really
22:27 < mnemoc> :(
22:27 < _Ragnar_> why?
22:28 < mnemoc> because my tries have failed dramaticly and i wanted to know if it was a general problem or just failing for me
22:28 < _Ragnar_> likely general problem >.< uclibc is a big mess
22:29 < mnemoc> :)
22:30 < _Ragnar_> I tried to get a recent sendmail to work with it, but I couldn't get it to resolve anything
22:30 < mnemoc> oh
22:31 < _Ragnar_> how is dietlibc these days?
22:32 < mnemoc> not better if you want to make a not cross-build build
22:33 < mnemoc> without perl you can't build autocrap on stage2 and everything goes to hell :(
22:33 < _Ragnar_> >.< sucks
22:33 < mnemoc> and i have been unable to allocate time for that :\
22:34 < _Ragnar_> yea :/
22:34 < _Ragnar_> always too little time
22:35 < mnemoc> yep :(
22:35 < karasz> mnemoc: kommrad is not around? or is he ignoring me ? ;)
22:36 < mnemoc> just ignoring you :)
22:36 < _Ragnar_> o_o
22:36 < karasz> :) thought so
22:36 < mnemoc> :)
22:39 < _Ragnar_> so what are you up to these days?
22:41 < mnemoc> in what field? :)
22:42 < _Ragnar_> in general
22:44 < mnemoc> difficult question :p
22:45 < _Ragnar_> why? :)
22:45 < mnemoc> because i'm too tired to think :p
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22:58 -!- Topic for #t2: T2 | 2.1.1.1 and 2.2.0-epsilon RELEASED! | The System Development Environment (SDE) | http://www.t2-project.org/ | Say hello and do not hesitate to ask us any questions that you may have. | http://www.rafb.net/paste/
22:58 -!- Topic set by mnemoc [] [Sat Mar 11 22:55:45 2006]
22:58 [Users #t2]
22:58 [@ChanServ ] [ dsoul ] [ michal`] [ mtr ] [ sepp_ ] [ _Ragnar_]
22:58 [ Baldzius_] [ karasz] [ mnemoc ] [ rxr ] [ tdi ]
22:58 [ CIA-7 ] [ laj ] [ morfoh ] [ rxr_] [ valentin]
22:58 -!- Irssi: #t2: Total of 16 nicks [1 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 15 normal]
22:58 -!- [freenode-info] please register your nickname...don't forget to auto-identify! http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#nicksetup
22:58 -!- Channel #t2 created Sun Aug 8 19:15:33 2004
22:59 -!- Irssi: Join to #t2 was synced in 31 secs
23:07 < karasz> cu all later
23:07 < karasz> bye
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23:09 < mnemoc> cu karasz
--- Log closed Sat May 20 00:00:21 2006