--- Log opened Sat Nov 11 00:00:27 2006 04:35 -!- idealm [n=ideal@218.82.58.130] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 04:54 -!- idealm [n=ideal@218.82.58.130] has joined #t2 08:06 -!- misl [n=chatzill@84-104-172-187.cable.quicknet.nl] has joined #t2 08:07 < misl> hi folks 08:17 < mtr> moin misl 08:17 < misl> hi mtr 08:46 < emte> moo 08:59 < sepp> quack 09:34 < rxr> moin 10:10 < rxr> http://linux.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=06/11/10/2336218&from=rss 10:11 < rxr> ^- "Dana Blankenhorn bluntly states a reality that many have known: 'The war is over and Linux won'. With Oracle and Microsoft putting Linux in the spotlight and positioning themselves to grow with Linux. 'A new report shows that 83% of companies expect to support new workloads on Linux against 23% for Windows. ... Over two-thirds of the respondents said they will increase their use of Linux in the next year, and almost no one said the opposite.'" 10:20 < CIA-5> rene * r20799 /trunk/package/graphic/scribus/scribus.desc: * updated scribus (1.3.3.4 -> 1.3.3.5) 10:29 < CIA-5> rene * r20800 /trunk/package/develop/git/git.desc: * updated git (1.4.3.3 -> 1.4.3.4) 10:29 < CIA-5> rene * r20801 /trunk/package/archiver/upx/upx.desc: * updated upx (2.02 -> 2.03) 10:33 -!- mtr_ [n=Michael@pD9E12746.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #t2 10:37 < rxr> moin mtr_ 10:37 [Users #t2] 10:37 [@ChanServ] [ capey] [ idealm] [ mtr ] [ sepp ] [ zod] 10:37 [ _Ragnar_] [ CIA-5] [ LMJ ] [ mtr_] [ Stelz ] 10:37 [ Baldzius] [ emte ] [ misl ] [ rxr ] [ valentin] 10:37 -!- Irssi: #t2: Total of 16 nicks [1 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 15 normal] 10:42 -!- mtr [n=Michael@pD9E12CC3.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 10:42 -!- mtr_ is now known as mtr 10:43 < CIA-5> rene * r20802 /trunk/package/security/gnutls/gnutls.desc: * updated gnutls (1.4.4 -> 1.4.5) 11:25 -!- sepp_ [n=sepp@p83.129.198.67.tisdip.tiscali.de] has joined #t2 11:27 [Users #t2] 11:27 [@ChanServ] [ capey] [ idealm] [ mtr ] [ sepp_ ] [ zod] 11:27 [ _Ragnar_] [ CIA-5] [ LMJ ] [ rxr ] [ Stelz ] 11:27 [ Baldzius] [ emte ] [ misl ] [ sepp] [ valentin] 11:27 -!- Irssi: #t2: Total of 16 nicks [1 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 15 normal] 11:29 < rxr> http://bugs.t2-project.org/ 11:29 < rxr> ^- go for it :-) 11:29 < rxr> mostly left is tunneling email out of the uni box 11:29 < rxr> (the uni drops all port 25 traffic intentionally since 2 year or so :-() 11:32 < Stelz> fine rxr :) 11:32 < Stelz> moin 11:32 < rxr> mon Stelz 11:32 < rxr> moin even .-))) 11:32 < Stelz> ;-) 11:33 < Stelz> login failed 11:33 < Stelz> hm 11:33 < Stelz> it's not an svn-login? 11:34 < Stelz> uhm rxr 11:34 < Stelz> Notice: Undefined variable: COOKIE in /home/flyspray-t2/scripts/register.php on line 8 11:34 < Stelz> in register form: http://bugs.t2-project.org/register 11:34 < rxr> nope, bug tracker is running a) on another and b) an independant system 11:35 < rxr> maybe you have no cockies enabled in your browser ? 11:35 < Stelz> no 11:35 < Stelz> after i clicked a button 11:35 < Stelz> 2 notices 11:35 < Stelz> Notice: Undefined variable: register_text in /home/flyspray-t2/scripts/modify.php on line 607 11:35 < Stelz> Notice: Undefined index: project_title in /home/flyspray-t2/scripts/modify.php on line 607 11:36 < rxr> indeed 11:36 < rxr> bummer 11:37 < rxr> you know, I did not write that - I just installed and hoped "for the best" 11:37 < rxr> thing is I first tried trac and it did not wanted to work out at all ... 11:37 < Stelz> :) 11:38 < Stelz> when i tried notification by email: there were 3 notices: 11:38 < Stelz> Notice: Undefined variable: register_text in /home/flyspray-t2/scripts/modify.php on line 607 11:38 < Stelz> Notice: Undefined index: project_title in /home/flyspray-t2/scripts/modify.php on line 607 11:38 < Stelz> Notice: Undefined index: flyspray_userid in /home/flyspray-t2/includes/notify.inc.php on line 264 11:38 < rxr> ack - I see the same on a test reg 11:38 < rxr> damn 11:38 < rxr> so what to do - hack it up or wipe it ... ? 11:39 < Stelz> rxr: did u look a mantis? 11:39 < Stelz> new version of it had been released a few days ago 11:40 < Stelz> Mantis is a php/MySQL/web based bugtracking system. Learn more. 11:40 < Stelz> The latest stable version is 1.0.6. 11:40 < Stelz> http://www.mantisbt.org/ 11:40 < Stelz> http://www.mantisbt.org/requirements.php 11:42 < rxr> Stelz: did you use it ? 11:43 < Stelz> no, cause i don' need any bug-tracker.. i don' have any 'really-big-prjects-to-track-a-lot-of-bugs' ;-) 11:43 < Stelz> but the distro i used previous time uses it 11:43 < Stelz> i mean.. people.. who created that source-base-distro 11:43 < Stelz> uses mantis 11:44 < rxr> which source based dist was tha tß 11:44 < Stelz> lunar 11:44 < Stelz> thats my previous distro 11:44 < Stelz> rxr: http://bugs.lunar-linux.org/view_all_bug_page.php <- mantis-page ;) 11:46 < rxr> hm 11:46 < rxr> I do not find it that good to follow and read (usability wise) - then I would like trac more 11:47 < rxr> http://trac.edgewall.org/ 11:47 < Stelz> hm, ok 11:47 < Stelz> i know, rxr ;-) 11:48 < rxr> http://www.hosted-projects.com/trac/TracDemo/Demo 11:48 < rxr> and we would get a svn browser for free with it 11:48 < rxr> (and a wiki if someone actually would want to use that= 11:48 < rxr> ) 11:49 < rxr> however it did not wanted to work out when I tried it yesterday 11:49 -!- sepp [n=sepp@p213.54.138.177.tisdip.tiscali.de] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 11:53 < rxr> what how good trac traceback looks: 11:53 < rxr> http://trac.edgewall.org/ticket/3351 11:56 < Stelz> rxr: what do u think about setting up a forum? 11:56 < rxr> ouhm 11:56 < rxr> does trac has a forum ? 11:56 < Stelz> nopey 11:57 < Stelz> but i know some nice/light/fast forum-engine 11:57 < Stelz> php5/mysql/sqlite based 11:57 < Stelz> very easy to install 11:57 < Stelz> and i have it 11:57 < Stelz> a lot of skins for it etc. 11:59 < rxr> well - thing is with every dynamic code stuff we potentially get more security issues on the servers and I'm not sure if we need it so much 12:00 < rxr> e.g. it just spreads the users over all the available content instead of focusing on a good homepage, handbook, ... 12:00 < rxr> or do you think ao forum is so vital and important ? 12:01 < Stelz> rxr: now we have only one place where we (a-lot-of-new-users?) can discuss some troubles and ask some questions - irc :| 12:02 < rxr> and the mailing list 12:02 < Stelz> of course 12:02 < rxr> Stelz: well - maybe you set it up and we see how it works out ? 12:03 < Stelz> rxr: 12:03 < Stelz> 13:51'48 | Stelz> and i have it 12:03 < Stelz> :) 12:03 < rxr> hm - on my office workstation I get the same trac errors trying to set it up as on the remote server 12:03 < rxr> so it is at least no "remote server f*ckup" or "remote server python* outdateness" ... 12:04 < rxr> (as my office workstation is T2/trunk up-to-data-as-possible :-) 12:06 < rxr> .oO(it appears to be a bug in the T2/trac packag Oo.) 12:07 < Stelz> rxr: 12:07 < Stelz> how T2 'll use soft for openbsd? 12:07 < Stelz> or just T2 == thing for compiling openbsd-kernel ? 12:08 < Stelz> seems to be that openbsd should use its port system or what? 12:11 < CIA-5> rene * r20803 /trunk/package/develop/trac/trac.conf: * removed trac.conf, it breaks everything instead of helping at all 12:22 < rxr> Stelz: well full OpenBSD support would mean that we get another Config entry on the top listing the supported Operating System Kernels and you can chosoe Linux, Minix, OpenBSD 12:22 < rxr> and then you do Build-Target as usual and instead a linux kernel the OpenBSD kernel 12:23 < rxr> and e.g. the OpenBSD LibC is used and so on 12:23 < rxr> T2/OpenBSD means using T2's build system to bulid the entire OpenBSD a-like CD ... 12:23 < Stelz> rxr: but what after installing? 12:23 < rxr> you use the usual T2 stuff 12:23 < Stelz> rxr: but what after installation? 12:23 < rxr> after all it is t2 based then 12:23 < rxr> you Emerge-Pkg something and your new two installer stuff when it is ready 12:24 < Stelz> hm.. i see 12:24 < rxr> of course _not_ the OpenBSD port system - the T2 one 12:24 < Stelz> then i need to dev two with-a-lot-of-kernels-support 12:25 < rxr> nope not all all 12:25 < rxr> it is just package management - nothing kernel dependant 12:26 < Stelz> but some package needs some fixes for some kernels 12:27 < rxr> http://bugs.t2-project.org:443/trac-t2 12:27 < rxr> Stelz: but that is nothing for two 12:27 < rxr> fixes go into t2/trunk/package/*/*/*/ ... 12:27 < rxr> in for of paches or $pkg.conf code 12:27 < Stelz> ahm\ 12:44 < rxr> http://trac.edgewall.org/changeset/3163 13:09 < rxr> ok - we most probably go trac then 13:09 < rxr> than 13:09 < rxr> then 13:09 < rxr> well ... 13:10 < rxr> Stelz: maybe you wannt setup your forum for testing ? 13:10 * rxr lunch 13:11 < Stelz> rxr: ? 13:11 < Stelz> at your machine? 13:19 -!- sepp_ is now known as sepp 13:19 < sepp> hello :) 13:22 < Stelz> rehi sepp 13:22 < sepp> hi Stelz 15:41 < rxr> re 15:41 < rxr> Stelz: ouhm 15:41 < rxr> Stelz: I meant on your side 15:41 < Stelz> rxr: 15:41 < rxr> Stelz: or no server at hand? 15:41 < rxr> hi sepp 15:41 [Users #t2] 15:41 [@ChanServ] [ capey] [ idealm] [ mtr ] [ Stelz ] 15:41 [ _Ragnar_] [ CIA-5] [ LMJ ] [ rxr ] [ valentin] 15:41 [ Baldzius] [ emte ] [ misl ] [ sepp] [ zod ] 15:41 -!- Irssi: #t2: Total of 15 nicks [1 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 14 normal] 15:41 < Stelz> 13:57'32 | Stelz> 13:51'48 | Stelz> and i have it 15:42 < Stelz> rxr: set up a forum sometimes ago (spring 2006) for our local trance-community 15:42 < Stelz> *i set up 15:42 < Stelz> but i think u won't like that skin :) 15:47 -!- Netsplit leguin.freenode.net <-> irc.freenode.net quits: @ChanServ 15:56 < sepp> hi rxr 16:48 -!- ChanServ [ChanServ@services.] has joined #t2 16:48 -!- ServerMode/#t2 [+o ChanServ] by irc.freenode.net 16:58 -!- tadao_ [n=tadao@242-200.dyn-fa.pool.ew.hu] has joined #t2 17:01 < tadao_> Hi T2 , Can i use T2 as an intermediate user to rebuild my favorite live cd (SLAX = 200mb inkl kde in squashfs+union) for via c3 ? 17:08 < rxr> tadao_: you can use T2 to build such a live-cd, yes 17:08 < rxr> but it will not be 100% slax then 17:08 < rxr> it will be T2 KDE+suqshfs+unionfs then ... 17:09 < Stelz> uhu 17:11 < tadao_> rxr : im ok with that , i just need normal users -by package choice slack is perfect -just somehow adduser doesnt work -are there manuals for beginners or only pro-stuff??? 17:13 < rxr> tadao_: http://www.t2-project.org/buildintro.html 17:13 < rxr> just choose LiveCD there and do your package selection 17:13 < rxr> should be mostly straight forward 17:17 < tadao_> rxr :saw that ,thanks ,how is kernelconfig /alsaconfig -can i use slax/kanotix configs ? how about xorg.conf xfree86 +unichrome (cle266)? 17:21 < sepp> you can reuse old configs 17:22 < sepp> xorg and unichrome is also working, i had a laptop with one of these cards 17:27 < tadao_> sepp : thanks sepp just have dvb/nova-s with slax running under unichrome with 45-70% load ,would like to rebuild that -thought t2 uses xfree 17:29 < tadao_> and openssl precompiled for use with padlock ; ) 17:29 < sepp> that was the via crypto extension? 17:30 < tadao_> as i understand hw cryptoaccelerator in cpu as fast as pIV 40 (forty!!!) in sw-mode 17:31 < tadao_> under openbsd standard in openssl , so very nice for paranoid ssh users -grin 17:32 < sepp> if it is in openssl you can build it somehow from source 17:35 < tadao_> yes iknow - just i thought know that i have now everything on my epia viac3 working i want to make my l" last config" allinone and rebuild it from source 17:45 < tadao_> as lean as possible -for full control , just till now im rather an average user with little indepth-knowledge , so i would like to finally see how the componets are forged together -what is essential and what not 17:46 < tadao_> so what size would me a minimal kde system (inkl k3b and organizer but nothing else) on livecd with squash ? 17:57 < sepp> hmm, well don't know exactly 17:57 < sepp> but it will fit on 1 cd 18:01 < sepp> i have no kde ... 18:02 < tadao_> wowwow toobig -so it depends on the "target"definition -> so howto shrink-redefine target "exact desktop" ... u use fluxbox ? 18:02 < sepp> the desktop livecd has many things on it, iirc even ooo 18:03 < sepp> and 1 cd, so if you remove things - less, but i can not say how much 18:03 < Stelz> tadao_: /me use fluxbox :) 18:05 < rxr> tadao_: it depends how much you strip away - e.g. stuff only neded for software compilation (include files, static libraries, libtool la files, ...) 18:05 < rxr> tadao_: and how many languages you ship ... 18:05 < rxr> you can get a minimal kde far below 100MB if one likes too 18:05 < tadao_> stelz : brave mohican ... i just miss kicker there 18:05 < rxr> I can help shrinking the stuff down here in IRC if you like 18:05 < Stelz> lol 18:05 < tadao_> rxr : oops how this 18:06 < tadao_> want that want that 18:06 < rxr> tadao_: want what? a 100MB KDE LiveCD ? 18:06 < Stelz> lol 18:07 < tadao_> 200 is ok and to ram cheatcode (they call it like this in slax and kanotix to load iso to ram and boot from there 18:11 < tadao_> slax has 190 mb with very simple kde (k3b and Korganizer ) runs like kerosin on my epia ,whiis only a poor little 1000mhz board (with nifty padlock and nicecle266) 18:12 < tadao_> so if you could explain howto get there or point a manual would be perfect ... 18:14 < tadao_> just i would prefer to start small and stay small rather than start with 1 GB and than strip it down 18:16 < tadao_> because i have the pkg list of the system already more or less (from slax ) -when i installed slackware11 on which slax is based i guess -i had already 1,5 GB 18:18 < rxr> the 190MB Slax is the compressed size? Expanded it hould be 800MB or so as well ... 18:19 < rxr> the handbook does not yet cover all the new LiveCD setup details 18:19 < rxr> tadao_: if you like I could commit some minimalkdelivecd target to trunk and you just have to tweak it for your needs ? 18:19 < tadao_> rxr -1yes squash and union like t2 compressed size 190MB 18:20 < tadao_> rxr: ooohh paradise for my two epias 18:20 < tadao_> yes please 18:21 < tadao_> cough cough -eh whats trunk ? 18:23 < rxr> trunk refers to the development tree of most open source projects, especially those using Subversion for version control 18:24 < tadao_> ahh so the red pill ... well how can i get there ... 18:25 < tadao_> sorry subversion yes ... 18:26 < CIA-5> rene * r20804 /trunk/target/archivista/TODO: * wiped most of archivista/TODO 18:26 < rxr> tadao_: http://www.t2-project.org/download.html 18:27 < rxr> svn co http://svn.exactcode.de/t2/trunk t2-trunk 18:30 < rxr> tadao_: I just started to define a minimal-kde-live target 18:30 < rxr> tadao_: just keep hanging out here - I think I can commit some version for you to continue working on by tomorrow 18:31 < tadao_> thanks wow thats a start !!! so i will build my perfect ramdisk workstation with dvb and hwaccelerated ssh wow , curious about the performace with a special c-5 buit system 18:32 < tadao_> sorry "built system " 18:34 < rxr> or we both start buliding now 18:34 < rxr> I just commited the minimal-kde-live target start 18:34 < rxr> so you could start building now while I work on the fine details 18:34 < CIA-5> rene * r20805 /trunk/target/mini-live-kde/ (12 files): 18:34 < CIA-5> * added the start of a minimal-live-kde target for demo purposes 18:34 < CIA-5> by quick cut'n pasting desktop and archivist target bits together 18:37 < tadao_> wow you like your project - well i have to leave my machine for an hour or so now but i opened this t2 interface already ( not svn )so ill start at 20.00 roundabout 18:38 < tadao_> but im a lousy learner -so any way time of halfknowledge is over now , lets build ...c-5 (is my built system too ) will take 4 times longer than athlon 2000 i guess 18:39 < tadao_> this means ... 3-4 days ???? for a built 18:39 < rxr> on that box mayber 18:39 < rxr> I build on my Core Duo MacBook @2GHz, it builds pretty quickly indeed :-) 18:41 < rxr> if you take your minimal-kde plan seriously I would enable ccache while building with T2 18:41 < tadao_> than ill plug in the second epia and just let it run - wowow that? another universe 18:41 < rxr> if you rebuild it in some weeks or much most compiler invocation will be taken out of the cache then 18:42 < tadao_> ... ehm if you say so ... just imagine i would come from republique congolaise 18:43 < tadao_> so i can enable ccache -but i have no clue what it means 18:43 < rxr> ccache is a program to cache compiler output 18:43 < rxr> T2 has integrated it so you just need to enable a ccache option inside T2's scripts/Config 18:44 < rxr> or you don't care for your first build ... and leave it as it is 18:44 < tadao_> good - checkboxes are my world ... still 18:47 < tadao_> wow i found th interesting points : unfortunately under expert menu : custom pkg selection etc realtime ... 18:48 < tadao_> so you meant *create cache files after packages have been built ? 18:48 < rxr> nope 18:49 < rxr> the option I meant is on the very top 18:49 < rxr> "Use compiler cache (ccache) where possible" 18:49 < rxr> btw. best leave the exper section unexpanded and untouched for now :-) 18:49 < rxr> until you finished your first CD :-) 18:52 < tadao_> poor me :(..... which kind of realtime is meantioned there ? 18:53 < tadao_> lsm rtai ??? 18:53 < rxr> I guess you meant realtime linux as in RTAI and such 18:53 < rxr> tadao_: it is for hard realtime kind of systems like industrial computing for laser and roboter control ... 18:53 < rxr> normal desktop boxes do not need it 18:54 < rxr> (just industrial controlers, airplanes, atom power plants and the like :-) 18:54 < rxr> nuclear power plant even 18:54 < tadao_> well ... i use emc which uses rtai i guess 18:54 < tadao_> wowowow 18:54 < tadao_> no powerplants 18:54 < tadao_> pleaze 18:55 < tadao_> this lsm would be interesting for connecting switches , relais etc .. 18:56 < CIA-5> rene * r20806 /trunk/package/python/mod_python/ (bash-31.patch mod_python.desc): * updated mod_python (3.1.4 -> 3.2.10) 18:56 < rxr> tadao_: yep for such stuff 18:56 < rxr> tadao_: maybe you give it a try after your minimal-kde-live CD based on T2 ? 18:57 < tadao_> harr harr ok complicated stuff on second run --- so bloody hell with ncurses i even can build remotely wow 18:59 < tadao_> can you some book on how the components of a system work together -not for compscientiss of course -for half witted noobs with sense for fooling around??? 19:00 < tadao_> ooops -can you recommend ---- 19:03 < rxr> the t2 components ? 19:08 < tadao_> no more general linux -so comparing some 2.0.0 system with 2.6.xy - or how to add usb to a naked system - e.g. whats hotplug - udev difference-an overall view intro for noobs -so looking at linux/bsd like lego 19:08 < rxr> hm - no ide 19:08 < rxr> a 19:08 < rxr> did you see our handbook already? 19:08 < rxr> it does not cover all - but some details 19:09 < rxr> and it is intended to become more and more a T2 build system _and general Linux overview_ 19:11 < tadao_> yes good start , interesting to build openbsd like this , i guess mr deraadt ( unfortunately) wouldnt like it 19:11 < tadao_> or to put pf into linux woowowow 19:16 < tadao_> well , anyway thank you so much for the lots of answers - so this evening ill run my first config (after plugging in my other epia) so i?l have my first clean "sourcebox" , no i have to setup svn on slackware -so im back in 90 min roundabout .ciao 19:18 < rxr> you just need to install subversion - no setup needed 19:22 < tadao_> ahh thats good news -i thought this cvs stuff is bloody complicate i never installed it - wow i found it on my slack cd -so here we go 19:22 -!- tadao_ [n=tadao@242-200.dyn-fa.pool.ew.hu] has quit ["Leaving"] 19:26 < rxr> http://bugs.t2-project.org/ 19:26 < rxr> have fun guys ... 19:26 [Users #t2] 19:26 [@ChanServ] [ capey] [ idealm] [ mtr ] [ Stelz ] 19:26 [ _Ragnar_] [ CIA-5] [ LMJ ] [ rxr ] [ valentin] 19:26 [ Baldzius] [ emte ] [ misl ] [ sepp] [ zod ] 19:26 -!- Irssi: #t2: Total of 15 nicks [1 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 14 normal] 19:29 < Stelz> yeah, rxr :) 19:29 < Stelz> good work 19:31 < Stelz> hmm rxr 19:31 < Stelz> Authentication information not available. Please refer to the installation documentation. 19:31 < Stelz> any idea how to reg?:) 19:36 < rxr> yes yes 19:36 < rxr> ongoing work ... 19:42 < rxr> Stelz: I have to read more trac documentation 19:42 < rxr> for now anaymous user can craete and modify tickets 21:11 < emte> ... you should have pointed tadao_ to the LFS docs 21:12 < emte> wouldnt explaining the different subsystems be beyond the scope of T2? 21:15 < emte> you would sudenly be trying to explain devfs vs udev and how dbus works and why you cant use dbus on 2.4 kernels etc 23:08 -!- misl [n=chatzill@84-104-172-187.cable.quicknet.nl] has quit ["Chatzilla 0.9.75 [Firefox 1.5.0.8/2006102516]"] --- Log closed Sun Nov 12 00:00:28 2006